Converting Epic Level Creatures

[Shade]

1,000 pounds works for me.

How about legendary tigers?

 

[Cleon]

That all sounds good (except vs. chaos, since he's lawful).

Updated.

Oops! I was thinking vs. Chaos, but it just came out wrong.

Urgh, is the 10% spell failure chance ok? It somewhat nerfs his casting. But he looks pretty good.

I find it acceptable, since he seems primarily a warrior before spellcaster. We can lower it if you'd prefer, though.

Good point, I'd much rather he not have any spell failure chance.

Hows about we give him Armoured Magic like we did the Faerie Queen?

Armored Mage (Ex): The Tiger General does not have an arcane spell failure chance when wearing light armor.
​

Then we could give General Ox a heavy version of that, since he's got a much lower land speed than the other Generals I think he might be slowed by heavy armour...

Heavy Armored Mage (Ex): The Ox General does not have an arcane spell failure chance when wearing light, Medium or Heavy armor.​

 

[Cleon]

It's ok, just wanted to make sure we thought about it.

Just need org, CR, and weight, I think. Weight, I can handle easily, sort of. Both balors and pit fiends are 12ft tall, and he's 9 ft, so we should divide the evil outsiders' weights by 2.37 for proportional scaling. However, the balor weights 4500 lb and the pit fiend 800 lb, so that gives us something between roughly 350 lb or 1900 lb! Split the difference and go with 1000 lb?

That seems rather high. If he was 6' tall General Tiger would weigh 296 pounds. Still, we made Monkey 900 pounds and Tiger ought to be about the same.

Maybe he's been stuffing himself with frosties.

I imagine Ox'd he extremely broadly built, so we'd better make him 1500 pounds or so.

For org, he's supposed to be accompanied by 100 loyal tigers, but we'll need to reduce the number and increase the CR. Any ideas?

I've given it some thought, and I like the idea of giving him 100 tigers so would fancy keeping it. They'd be a bit of a pain to keep track off, so I thought we'd make most of them awakened dire tigers who are basically just there to deal with the riff-raff, and have a core of higher-CR lieutenants who are actually able to help General Tiger deal with tough customers.

Legendary tigers seem a fine foundation, so I came up with the following:

Organization: Solitary; tiger-squad (General tiger and 5-10 tiger creatures of CR 19-20 such as 48 HD awakened legendary tigers, awakened legendary tiger 10th level shadowdancers, and LN rakshasa 10th level sorcerers) or tiger-host (General tiger plus 10 tiger creatures of CR 19-20 plus 100 awakened elite dire tigers)

Oh, and in a moment of insanity I statted some of them up. I had a moment of lucidity which prevented me working out the Rakshasa thought.

You may notice they’ve all got cloaks of resistance - I just found the idea of an army of tigers wearing decorated cloaks hilarious!

General Tiger's Shadowy Followers
awakened legendary tiger 10th level shadowdancer
Large Magical Beast (Augmented Animal)
Hit Dice: 28d10+10d8+266 (465 hp)
Initiative: +11 (+7 Dex, +4 Improved Initiative)
Speed: 80 ft. (16 squares)
Armor Class: 32 (–1 size, +7 Dex, +3 armour, +3 deflection, +10 natural), touch 19, flat-footed 25 [includes +3 ring of protection , +3 bracers of armour]
Base Attack/Grapple: +35/+50
Attack: Claw +46 melee (3d6+12/19-20) [includes +1 amulet of mighty fists]
Full Attack: 2 claws +46 melee (3d6+12/19-20) and bite +44 melee (2d8+5) [includes +1 amulet of mighty fists]
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Pounce, improved grab, rake 2d6+5
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60 ft., defensive roll, hide in plain sight, improved evasion, improved uncanny dodge, scent, shadow illusion [1/day silent image], shadow jump 160 ft., slippery mind, summon shadow
Saves: Fort +26, Ref +34, Will +22 [includes +4 cloak of resistance]
Abilities: Str 32, Dex 25, Con 24, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12 [includes +4 gloves of dexterity]
Skills: Climb +11, Escape Artist +22, Hide +47, Jump +31, Listen +30, Move Silently +45, Perform (dance) +6, Spot +30, Swim +16, Tumble +22 [includes boots of elvenkind , ring of chameleon power]
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Dextrous Mind, Dextrous Fortitude, Dodge, Epic Reflexes, Epic Speed, Epic Will, Improved Critical (claws), Improved Initiative, Improved Natural Attack (Claw), Mobility, Multiattack, Track
Environment: Any forest, hill, mountains, plains, or underground
Organization: Solitary or pair
Challenge Rating: 20
Treasure: See Equipment
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 29–48 HD (Large)

Combat

Pounce (Ex): If a legendary tiger leaps upon a foe during the first round of combat, it can make a full attack even if it has already taken a move action.

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, the legendary tiger must hit with a bite attack. If it gets a hold, it can rake.

Rake (Ex): A legendary tiger can make two attacks (+30 melee) against a held creature with its hind legs for 2d6+5 points of Damage each. If the legendary tiger pounces on an opponent, it can also rake.

Skills: Legendary tigers receive a +8 racial bonus on Hide and Move Silently checks. *In areas of tall grasses or heavy undergrowth, the Hide bonus improves to +16.

Equipment: +1 amulet of mighty fists , +3 ring of protection , +3 bracers of armour , +4 cloak of resistance , boots of elvenkind , ring of chameleon power , +4 gloves of dexterity
total value 80,000 gp adds up to a CR 20 Treasure

General Tiger's Ferocious Followers
48HD awakened advanced legendary tiger
Large Magical Beast (Augmented Animal)
Hit Dice: 48d10+384 (648 hp)
Initiative: +13 (+5 Dex, +8 Improved Initiative)
Speed: 50 ft.
Armor Class: 30 (–1 size, +5 Dex, +4 armour, +2 deflection, +10 natural), touch 16, flat-footed 25 [includes +4 bracers of armour, +2 ring of protection]
Base Attack/Grapple: +48/+67
Attack: Claw +63 melee (3d6+16)
Full Attack: 2 claws +63 melee (3d6+16) and bite +63 melee (3d8+8) [includes +1 amulet of mighty fists]
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Pounce, improved grab, rake 3d6+8
Special Qualities: Scent
Saves: Fort +37, Ref +38, Will +27 [includes +3 cloak of resistance]
Abilities: Str 40, Dex 20, Con 26, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 12 [includes +4 belt of giant strength, +2 gloves of dexterity]
Skills: Climb +27, Hide +40* [+48 in jungle], Jump +23, Listen +33, Move Silently +43, Spot +33, Swim +20 [Hide +50*, Move Silently +53 with elixir of hiding, elixir of sneaking]
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Epic Reflexes, Epic Skill Focus (Hide), Epic Skill Focus (Listen), Epic Skill Focus (Move Silently), Epic Skill Focus (Spot), Epic Will, Improved Initiative, Improved Multiattack, Improved Natural Attack (bite), Improved Natural Attack (claw), Iron Will, Multiattack, Power Attack, Run, Superior Initiative, Track
Environment: Any forest, hill, mountains, plains, or underground
Organization: Solitary or pair
Challenge Rating: 19
Treasure: See Equipment
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: –

Combat

Pounce (Ex): If a legendary tiger leaps upon a foe during the first round of combat, it can make a full attack even if it has already taken a move action.

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, the legendary tiger must hit with a bite attack. If it gets a hold, it can rake.

Rake (Ex): General tiger’s ferocious follower can make two attacks (+63 melee) against a held creature with its hind legs for 3d6+8 points of Damage each. If the legendary tiger pounces on an opponent, it can also rake.

Skills: Legendary tigers receive a +8 racial bonus on Hide and Move Silently checks. *In areas of tall grasses or heavy undergrowth, the Hide bonus improves to +16.

Equipment: +1 amulet of mighty fists, brooch of shielding, +4 belt of giant strength, +4 bracers of armour, +3 cloak of resistance, elixir of hiding, elixir of sneaking, +2 gloves of dexterity, +2 ring of protection
total value 61,000 gp adds up to a CR 19 Treasure

General Tiger's Rank and File Followers
awakened elite dire tiger
Large Magical Beast (Augmented Animal, Dire)
Hit Dice: 18d10+72 (171 hp)
Initiative: +4
Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares)
Armor Class: 20 (–1 size, +4 Dex, +1 armour, +9 natural), touch 13, flat-footed 16 [includes +1 bracers of armour]
Base Attack/Grapple: +18/+32
Attack: Claw +28 melee (2d4+10)
Full Attack: 2 claws +28 melee (2d4+10) and bite +25 melee (3d6+5)
Space/Reach: 10 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Improved grab, pounce, rake 2d4+5
Special Qualities: Low-light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +16, Ref +16, Will +14 [includes +1 cloak of resistance]
Abilities: Str 30, Dex 19, Con 19, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 10
Skills: Hide +17* [+21 in jungles], Jump +16, Listen +13, Move Silently +17, Spot +16, Swim +12 [includes eyes of the eagle]
Feats: Alertness, Improved Natural Attack (claw), Improved Natural Attack (bite), Multiattack, Run, Stealthy, Weapon Focus (claw)
Environment: Warm forests
Organization: Solitary or pair
Challenge Rating: 9
Treasure: See Equipment
Alignment: Always neutral
Advancement: 19–32 HD (Large); 33–48 (Huge)
Level Adjustment: —

Combat

A dire tiger attacks by running at prey, leaping, and clawing and biting as it rakes with its rear claws.

Improved Grab (Ex): To use this ability, a dire tiger must hit with its bite attack. It can then attempt to start a grapple as a free action without provoking an attack of opportunity. If it wins the grapple check, it establishes a hold and can rake.

Pounce (Ex): If a dire tiger charges, it can make a full attack, including two rake attacks.

Rake (Ex): Attack bonus +25 melee, damage 2d4+5.

Skills: Dire tigers have a +4 racial bonus on Hide and Move Silently checks. *In areas of tall grass or heavy undergrowth, the Hide bonus improves to +8.

Equipment: +1 bracers of armour, +1 cloak of resistance, eyes of the eagle.
total value 4,500 gp adds up to a CR 9 Treasure

Elite stats were Str 14, Dex 15, Con 13, Int 10, Wis 12, Cha 8

 

[freyar]

I'm not sure I like the rakshasa (rakshasas should be eeeeee-vil), but I can go with the rest.

Speaking of tigers, did you guys see about the tiger cub packed in luggage today? Video, too.

 

[Cleon]

I'm not sure I like the rakshasa (rakshasas should be eeeeee-vil), but I can go with the rest.

They don't have the Evil subtype you know.

It just seemed a good fit for a magical-support follower, since it's an anthropomorphic tiger spellcaster. I guess we could say it isn't actually a rakshasa, but just uses the same stats (except alignment).

Besides, I've already statted one out and it'd be a shame to waste it.

Speaking of tigers, did you guys see about the tiger cub packed in luggage today? Video, too.

Yes I did, it was in a couple of the UK papers.

 

[Cleon]

Speaking of the rakshasa, I might as well post it for your consideration.

By the way, I've also finished statting up General Monkey's followers. The Monkey Druid was the trickiest. I'll post them too when I find the time.

I cheated a little by making its Charisma-boosting item a crown rather than a robe.

General Tiger's Sorcerous Followers
LN elite tiger-sorcerer 10th level sorcerer
Medium Outsider (Native)
Hit Dice: 7d8+10d4+85 (141 hp)
Initiative: +8
Speed: 40 ft. (8 squares)
Armor Class: 28 (+4 Dex, +3 armour, +2 deflection, +9 natural), touch 16, flat-footed 24 [includes +3 bracers of defense, +2 ring of protection]
Base Attack/Grapple: +12/+12
Attack: Claw +12 melee (1d4)
Full Attack: 2 claws +12 melee (1d4) and bite +7 melee (1d6)
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Special Attacks: Detect thoughts, spells
Special Qualities: Change shape, damage reduction 15/good and piercing, darkvision 60 ft., spell resistance 27
Saves: Fort +17, Ref +16, Will +17 [includes +4 cloak of resistance]
Abilities: Str 10, Dex 19, Con 20, Int 16, Wis 12, Cha 30 [includes +2 amulet of health, +6 crown of charisma, +2 gloves of dexterity]
Skills: Bluff +34*, Concentration +25, Craft (alchemy) +13, Knowledge (arcana) +13, Diplomacy +24, Disguise +24 (+26 acting)*, Intimidate +22, Knowledge (arcana) +13, Listen +13, Move Silently +14, Perform (oratory) +13, Sense Motive +11, Spellcraft +23, Spot +13
Feats: Combat Casting, Improved Initiative, Spell Penetration, Greater Spell Penetration, Spell Focus (Illusion), Spell Focus (Transmutation)
Environment: Warm marshes
Organization: Solitary
Challenge Rating: 20
Treasure: Standard coins; double goods; standard items
Alignment: Always lawful neutral
Advancement: By character class
Level Adjustment: +7

General tiger is served by tiger-sorcerers, creatures closely related to rakshasas. Unlike true rakshasas, they do not have "backwards hands" and are neutral in alignment rather than evil. Their appearance and abilities are otherwise identical to a rakshasa. The origins of tiger-sorcerers are mysterious, some sages believe they are an ancestral race to the rakshasa who were never turned evil, others believe they are rakshasas who redeemed and underwent some form of transformation.

Tiger-sorcerers speak Common, Celestial, and Sylvan.

Combat
In close combat, which they disdains as ignoble, tiger-sorcerers employs its sharp claws and powerful bite. Whenever possible, it uses its other abilities to make such encounters unnecessary.

Detect Thoughts (Su): A tiger-sorcerer can continuously use detect thoughts as the spell (caster level 18th; Will DC 15 negates). It can suppress or resume this ability as a free action. The save DC is Charisma-based.

Spells: General tiger's tiger-sorcerer followers casts spells as a 17th-level sorcerer.

Typical Sorcerer Spells Known(6/7/7/7/7/7/7/7/5; save DC 20 + spell level):

0—arcane mark, detect magic, detect poison, light, mage hand, message, read magic, resistance, touch of fatigue;
1st—charm person, mage armor, magic missile, shield, silent image;
2nd— acid arrow, bear’s endurance, blindness/deafness, hideous laughter, mirror image;
3rd—fly, haste, slow, suggestion;
4th—bestow curse, charm monster, greater invisibility, phantasmal killer*;
5th—baleful polymorph*, break enchantment, hold monster, magic jar;
6th—disintegrate*, greater dispel magic, true seeing;
7th—greater shadow conjuration*, greater teleport, mage's sword;
8th—polar ray, polymorph any object*;*+1 DC for Spell Focus
Change Shape (Su): A tiger-sorcerer can assume any humanoid form, or revert to its own form, as a standard action. In humanoid form, a tiger-sorcerer loses its claw and bite attacks (although it often equips itself with weapons and armor instead). A tiger-sorcerer remains in one form until it chooses to assume a new one. A change in form cannot be dispelled, but the tiger-sorcerer reverts to its natural form when killed. A true seeing spell reveals its natural form.

Skills: A tiger-sorcerer has a +4 racial bonus on Bluff and Disguise checks. *When using change shape, a tiger-sorcerer gains an additional +10 circumstance bonus on Disguise checks. If reading an opponent’s mind, its circumstance bonus on Bluff and Disguise checks increases by a further +4.

Equipment: +2 amulet of health, +2 bracers of defense, +4 cloak of resistance, +6 crown of charisma [as cloak of charisma except for head slot], +2 gloves of dexterity, +2 ring of protection, ring of sustenance, whip feather token
total value 80,000 gp adds up to a CR 20 Treasure

Elite Ability Array Assignment: Str 8, Dex 13, Con 12, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 15
Tiger-Sorcerer [Rakshasa] Ability Bonuses: +2 Strength, +4 Dexterity, +6 Constitution, +2 Intelligence, +2 Wisdom, +6 Charisma
Ability Raises from HD Advancement: 3 points, all in Charisma.

 

[Shade]

Yeah, I'm not too fond of the rakshasa followers for him, either.

Cleon--No need to stat up followers. Feel free to do 'em for your own enjoyment, but I'd rather not make every monster entry novel-length with young, juveniles, and awakened monkey druid followers!

 

[Cleon]

Yeah, I'm not too fond of the rakshasa followers for him, either.

Cleon--No need to stat up followers. Feel free to do 'em for your own enjoyment, but I'd rather not make every monster entry novel-length with young, juveniles, and awakened monkey druid followers!

Well I know I don't need to stat them up, I just find it satisfying.

I suspect none of us would be here if we didn't like wasting our time statting up monsters.

 

[Shade]

Well I know I don't need to stat them up, I just find it satisfying.

I suspect none of us would be here if we didn't like wasting our time statting up monsters.

Fair enough, and so true!

I just wanted to make sure you knew why I didn't include 'em in the CC entries.

Updated.

Unless I missed it, we haven't assigned feats and skills!

Skills: 15 at 33 ranks

Feats: 11 (4 can be epic) plus 11 fighter bonus feats (nonepic)
Dodge -> Whirlwind Attack feat tree?
Combat Expertise feat tree?
WF, GWF, WS, GWS (longsword)?
Multiattack/Improved Multiattack?

 

[Cleon]

Fair enough, and so true!

I just wanted to make sure you knew why I didn't include 'em in the CC entries.

Would you like to see my monkeys though?

Updated.

Why did we just have them change shape into animals of their own phenotype again?

All the Animal Generals had shapechange at will in the original version!

Unless I missed it, we haven't assigned feats and skills!

Skills: 15 at 33 ranks

Feats: 11 (4 can be epic) plus 11 fighter bonus feats (nonepic)
Dodge -> Whirlwind Attack feat tree?
Combat Expertise feat tree?
WF, GWF, WS, GWS (longsword)?
Multiattack/Improved Multiattack?

Whirlwind Attack is part of the Combat Expertise tree, not Dodge, but it's OK by me.

Shall we work out the fighter feats first?

I'd go:

1. Combat Reflexes.
2. Combat Expertise
3. Improved Disarm
4. Improved Feint
5. Improved Trip
6. Whirlwind Attack.
7. Weapon Focus (longsword)
8. Greater Weapon Focus (longsword)
9. Weapon Specialisation (longsword)
10. Greater Weapon Specialisation (longsword)
11. Improved Critical (longsword).

Better use one of its regular feats to buy Power Attack too.

I'd only give it Multiattack & Improved Multiattack if it can make a bite and claw as secondary attacks with its longsword. Which obviously I think it should have...

Throw in Improved Initiative since General Monkey has it?

For its epic feats, he doesn't need Dire Charge since he has the Pounce SA but I'm tempted give it Devastating Critical (longsword), which means we need Cleave, Greate Cleave and Overwhelming Critical (longsword).

That leaves one regular feat and two epic feats.

We've been neglecting its magic, so I think Epic Spellcasting and Automatic Quicken Spell to make up for it. It'll need Quicken Spell as a prereq.

That's the lot:

Non-fighter bonus feats, with Epic Feats in bold:

1. Multiattack
2. Improved Multiattack
3. Improved Initiative
4. Quicken Spell
5. Power Attack
6. Cleave
7. Great Cleave
8. Overwhelming Critical (longsword)
9. Devastating Critical (longsword)
10. Automatic Quicken Spell
11. Epic Spellcasting or Automatic Quicken Spell×2

I reckon its full attack line is now:

Full Attack: +5 axiomatic ghost touch vicious vorpal longsword +47/+42/+37/+32 melee (2d6+25 plus 2d6 vicious/17-20, on a critical it does 5d6+50 plus 2d6 vicious plus Fort DC X or die plus decapitation on a natural 20) and claw +40 melee (1d10+5) and bite +40 melee (2d10+5); or 2 claws +40 melee (1d10+11) and bite +40 melee (2d10+5)

Looks pretty harmless to me.

EDIT: Upon reflection, I think I'd rather give it a second Automatic Quicken Spells than Epic Spellcasting.