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Years after completely ditching the system, WotC makes their move!

Danny seems to think they might be planning some sort of re-release. I honestly hope they aren't THAT stupid to think any of us angry with them will suddenly start buying their products again.

Not really- I haven't given any real thought as to what their actual plans are. I just know it's one possibility, just like taking all of their 3.X product and burying it in a landfill.

Consider this: if 4Ed somehow did crash & burn, they'd have to replace it. If they do not defend their rights in 3.X now, their only path would be producing another new version of D&D- IOW, 5Ed. They couldn't base it too much on 3.5 if they wanted because the IP would be compromised (I mean, they could, but it wouldn't make good business sense).

By ensuring that they have properly defended IP, they would at least have the option of re-release and upgrade of 3.5, which they could do much more quickly and with a good idea of it's value in the market.

And personally, I'm not taking any of this personally. While WotC has done some boneheaded things in my view, it's not like they're sending all proceeds of their Deluxe Dolphinskin-bound Core 3 to the KKK and NAMBLA- they simply haven't done anything to prevent me from buying a good RPG product if they put one out.
 
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I can't really say I'd take it personally either ... but it's yet another in a long line of very petty and ultimately purposeless flexing of their legal muscle, and another in a line of decisions that have upset a portion of their (former?) fan base.

I feel sorry for the poor person who is tasked with fostering good feelings towards WotC, should they ever hire such a person ...
 


Not really- I haven't given any real thought as to what their actual plans are. I just know it's one possibility, just like taking all of their 3.X product and burying it in a landfill.

Consider this: if 4Ed somehow did crash & burn, they'd have to replace it. If they do not defend their rights in 3.X now, their only path would be producing another new version of D&D- IOW, 5Ed. They couldn't base it too much on 3.5 if they wanted because the IP would be compromised (I mean, they could, but it wouldn't make good business sense).

By ensuring that they have properly defended IP, they would at least have the option of re-release and upgrade of 3.5, which they could do much more quickly and with a good idea of it's value in the market.

And personally, I'm not taking any of this personally. While WotC has done some boneheaded things in my view, it's not like they're sending all proceeds of their Deluxe Dolphinskin-bound Core 3 to the KKK and NAMBLA- they simply haven't done anything to prevent me from buying a good RPG product if they put one out.


My take on it is that Danny pretty much has the gist of it right, as far as the legal perspective, from what I've skimmmed. However, he nailed it when he said they ought to license the site so the site can stay in business, they keep the goodwill of fans, and their IP is protected.

Why aren't they doing this? That's the real question. Here's my theory and prediction:

Mearls isn't as stupid as his predecessors from a business sense, he likes older editions, and he is aware of the PR blunders of the past. The only reason to repeat one, even to a lesser degree, would be to have a positive side to it---or at least something WOTC can spin as a positive to the fans, while at the same time making money off of it.

Which leads me to think that there will be a re-release of older material, like as in ALL of it, going back to the OD&D books, in a way that WOTC can make money from it.

The real money-maker for the company now is DDI subscriptions, as opposed to book sales, because everyone knows the books will be outdated due to errata in a matter of months. What better way to get people who want nothing to do with paying a subscription to DDI because they don't play 4e than to release all material for all older versions of the game? How many people would pay 10 or 20 bucks a month for access to everything?

Short of that, they will release everything in pdf format, thus making up for their massive blunder of a couple years ago.

They've blown their load on Essentials, they've scaled back book releases, there is no new revenue stream on the horizon with the current system, nothing that's going to significantly jack up profits using the IP they are currently in bed with. What they are doing now is a preemptive strike to protect their future plans and revenue streams, as much as it is a way to preserve, even if temporarily, the current hegemony (wished for in their own minds) of 4e.

Making older versions available electronically is a win win for everyone, from their perspective.

My only question now is whether they will go after the clones.
 

Mearls isn't as stupid as his predecessors from a business sense, he likes older editions, and he is aware of the PR blunders of the past. The only reason to repeat one, even to a lesser degree, would be to have a positive side to it---or at least something WOTC can spin as a positive to the fans, while at the same time making money off of it.
I wonder just how much if any Mearls had much to do with this move. I always pictured their legal department as being an extension of Hasbro Corp, less than part of the WOTC team. Especially since the GSL debacle, which made me start thinking the legal department had oversight over Wotc themselves :uhoh:.
 

Why do lawyer jokes always fall flat?
Because lawyers don't think they're funny, and non-lawyers don't think they're jokes.
When I was in law school, my classmate and I collected about 1,100 distinct lawyer jokes. (By "distinct," I mean (a) not re-purposed "whatever" jokes, and (b) not just variations.) Most folks'd be surprised how much most lawyers appreciate lawyer jokes.

What lawyers most appreciate, though, is how much everybody forgets how much they "hate" lawyers ... you know, just as soon as they need one.

EDIT: Inflationary memory.
 
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Why aren't they doing this? That's the real question.

My guess? Hasbro. Despite hiring the people, they probably still don't understand the hobby.

(...although your speculation has a feel to it that I'd like to see realized)

My only question now is whether they will go after the clones.

I don't see that as a winning proposition for WotC, legally or as a PR move, unless someone's being REALLY egregious.


I always pictured their legal department as being an extension of Hasbro Corp, less than part of the WOTC team. Especially since the GSL debacle, which made me start thinking the legal department had oversight over Wotc themselves

Even if WotC's legal still got the same personnel as before Hasbro gobbled them up, Hasbro is still going to have the last word if they so choose.
 

Which leads me to think that there will be a re-release of older material, like as in ALL of it, going back to the OD&D books, in a way that WOTC can make money from it.

The real money-maker for the company now is DDI subscriptions, as opposed to book sales, because everyone knows the books will be outdated due to errata in a matter of months. What better way to get people who want nothing to do with paying a subscription to DDI because they don't play 4e than to release all material for all older versions of the game? How many people would pay 10 or 20 bucks a month for access to everything?
I've been a little surprised WotC hasn't already done something along the lines of a proprietary ebook format, with a reader accessible via DDI. This seems to me a fairly obvious route toward trying to suck old editioners into a DDI sub and make money off people they otherwise wouldn't attract.

On the flipside, it also seems doomed to fail, since someone will have cracked such a thing within a couple weeks of its release-- and the stuff is out there already anyway.

Personally, I'm hoping for a PDF release rather than a system that requires a subscription, as that will give those of us leery of subscriptions a legitimate way to get the material. But frankly I'm not holding my breath.

Time will tell. For now, I'm more than happy to curl up with the OGL protected stuff. (Which, all bashing aside, we have lawyers to thank for.)
 

I've been a little surprised WotC hasn't already done something along the lines of a proprietary ebook format, with a reader accessible via DDI. This seems to me a fairly obvious route toward trying to suck old editioners into a DDI sub and make money off people they otherwise wouldn't attract.

I wouldn't be surprised if they're not waiting for the eReader war to settle down a bit, like VHS vs Beta or DVD-HD vs Blu-Ray. That way, they spend less money putting their IP in a variety of formats.

Personally, I'm hoping for a PDF release rather than a system that requires a subscription, as that will give those of us leery of subscriptions a legitimate way to get the material.

From your keyboard to God's inbox!

How does NAMBLA feel about Elves? KKK about Dwarves? LMAO

The KKK is probably fine with most Dwarves except the Swirfneblin.

And I don't think any fantasy races except the Halflings & Kender have anything to worry about from NAMBLA.
 
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I don't see how they could justify a DDI setup for older editions w/o adding new content each month. Yeah, it's great to access archives of rules and whatnot, but if that's never getting added to, why in the hell should I use your subscription service? And if they DO start making new content, again, it would go directly against their entire stance/strategy regarding older editions for years now. I just can't see them doing that...

For myself, even if I hadn't sworn off ever giving them a dollar again, I'm also no fan of subscription services, like the orc within. I prefer to just buy stuff to own and have that be the end of it. I may use something for a few months, then not touch it for years and suddenly want to play with it again. If it's a subscription service that might entail signing on for a longer term than I need, and the very real possibility of the service no longer being available years later when I want to go back to it.
 

Into the Woods

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