The Mysterious Mage vs. Pew Pew

[Umbran]

T
Mostly, I'm interested in folk's opinion why all this changed, and why now is the old way of handling magic badwrongfun?

First you'd have to tell us where you got the idea the old way was badwrongfun.

I think handling magic significantly differently than non-magic isn't a good idea for several reasons, ranging from fairness to plausibility.

From there... in the real world, lives don't go according to plan. People go to school, learn work related skills and knowledge things, but only some folks manage to end up doing exactly what they trained to do in school. In the real world, people change careers, trades, and focus pretty frequently.

Now, in my fictional world, maybe it doesn't make much sense for a character to pick up advanced magical abilities without having shown previous predilection for them. Maybe that stretches some people's suspension of disbelief. But, on the other hand, having a character only be able to respond to influences in his world through herculean effort, or not at all, often leads to a less satisfying fiction. Pick your poison.

 

[Umbran]

1987: Ars Magica introduces verb-noun magic system.

1993: Mage the Ascension introduces reality warping based magic.

1995: Skills and Powers introduces new magic systems into AD&D, including spell-point and fatigue based ones.

1989: Shadowrun is published with a fatigue-based magic system. I don't know if others went that route prior, but given the game's popularity at the time, I suspect is had some influence.

 

[Eric Tolle]

1989: Shadowrun is published with a fatigue-based magic system. I don't know if others went that route prior, but given the game's popularity at the time, I suspect is had some influence.

Man, I knew I was forgetting something. I also left out the Endurance Battery from Champions, which was also used to simulate mana-pool style magic.

Of course that also leaves out all the private attempts to do different magic systems in D&D. It seems like 2 out 3 DMs I gamed with were coming up with alternatives to the fire-and-forget magic system. The interesting thing is that thanks to the save system in AD&D, fighters weren't overshadowed...though I admit rogues became useless.

 

[Bluenose]

For your consideration

1977: Arduin Grimoire: D&D variant, introduced a mana system.

1977: Wizard, a microgame, with permanently known spells that cost points ( users had a number based on Strength) to cast spells. Eventually became a strong influence on GURPS.

1978: Real Magic introduced alternate skill-roll based magic system.

1978: Runequest, a D&D derived game uses a spell points based magic system.

1980: The Fantasy Trip consolidates Wizard with its sister game Melee.

1975: Tunnels and Trolls beats Wizard to using a spell point system based on the caster's Strength score.

(2011: Bluenose expresses some doubt that Runequest is derived from D&D in any significant way other than the concept of Role-Playing Game.)

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Man, I forgot all about the Wizard and Melee microgames. I loved the art in their ads. Did those have Jeff Dee art?

 

[Crazy Jerome]

2011: Bluenose expresses some doubt that Runequest is derived from D&D in any significant way other than the concept of Role-Playing Game.)

RQ is more "reaction against" than "derived from" D&D. However, that is still a form of influence. RQ is definitely influenced by the presence of D&D.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I remember there being a lot of speculation before 3rd. Edition came out that WOTC would switch to a spell-point system-the fact that WOTC retained the fire-and-forget system of previous editions I attribute to institutional inertia and a desire to appeal to conservative fans that are resistant to change.

I wonder if they expected the sorcerer to be embraced to a much greater degree than it was.

 

[Stormonu]

First you'd have to tell us where you got the idea the old way was badwrongfun.

It's from comments such as the wizard "spending the game cowering behind the fighter after casting his only spell(s)" and "throwing darts instead of casting spells is worthless".

Granted, low-level spellcasters in D&D have been weak, but I don't remember them being "completely useless" when they weren't throwing spells.

 

[Votan]

1977: Arduin Grimoire: D&D variant, introduced a mana system.

1977: Wizard, a microgame, with permanently known spells that cost points ( users had a number based on Strength) to cast spells. Eventually became a strong influence on GURPS.

1978: Real Magic introduced alternate skill-roll based magic system.

1978: Runequest, a D&D derived game uses a spell points based magic system.

1980: The Fantasy Trip consolidates Wizard with its sister game Melee.

In 1980 you also get Rolemaster, which had a combination of spell lists and spell points. It was, like Runequest, one of the two alternatives to Vancian casting back in my early gaming career.

 

[Hussar]

Back in the days I played of BECM, 1E and part of 2E, the magicks of mages was infrequent and deadly. When a wizard stepped up to cast a spell, it was a thing to fear, but it often took great danger for the wizard to step forward in the first place. While the use of magic was certainly powerful, it was exercised with restraint.

"It took great danger for the wizard to step forward in the first place"? Really? Why? You had five or six PC's standing in front of you, plus another five or six henchmen in your party. Stepping up wasn't dangerous in the slightest.

Why in hell does everyone presume that the wizard was ever getting into melee combat?