Why the love for the Edition Treadmill?

[DEFCON 1]

I agree completely. This is why I've watched only A New Hope, Raiders of the Lost Ark, and The Fellowship Of The Ring. And why my G.I. Joe collection only includes Short-Fuze, Grunt, and Flash. And why I never bothered with Laverne & Shirley, Mork & Mindy, and Joanie Love Chachi. I've read just The Gunslinger. And I only listen to Bleach and never Nevermind or In Utero.

Why bother with all that stuff that came afterwards? Who needs it? I mean heck... Airborne, Gung-Ho, and Torpedo came out ONLY A YEAR after the first series of figures!!! What kind of treadmill is that?!?

 

[Halivar]

There is nothing I love more than playing new games and exploring what they have to offer.

Then again, as a techie, I am used upgrading everything after 2 years, even if the old stuff still works. I love re-imagining things.

Exceptioin: G1 Transformers are still the best Transformers. That is all.

 

[drothgery]

The short lifespan of 4e is, in my opinion, best described by one of two models.

What 'short' lifespan? If, as seems likely right now, 5e (or whatever WotC calls it) is actually launched at GenCon 2013, 4e lasted 5 years. Just like 3.5, and longer than 3.0. TSR AD&D edition lifespans were really long, but that was an anomaly even for TSR; OD&D -> AD&D was five years, too.

 

[thedungeondelver]

I've never been on an "edition treadmill". I got out of AD&D just as 2e was hitting, and rejoined just as 3e was hitting, only I picked back up with 1e and have been there ever since. The funkyness of 3e annoyed me, but the LOOOOOOOL TROLLING YOOOOOOOOU of 4e was frankly infuriating. Both of those kept me off any sort of treadmill.

I can't believe there's people here already predicting the end of D&D next edition. That's...that's pretty brazen, I tell you what. Also, considering that this D&D will, if Ryan Dancey was telling only half the truth, be the do-or-die edition it may well be that it is the last edition regardless. New sets of powers will be covered in new books, but the core will remain the same, that's what it looks like from here.

Of course, right now we have a 200 power telescope, and we're viewing D&D Next as it transits orbit. Once we get closer, I'll have a better idea of whether or not this is the DOMESDAY BOOK of D&D rules or Yet Another Edition. If it is the latter, I'll thank WOTC for their time and go back to AD&D (I'm going back to AD&D regardless, but I want D&D Next to succeed, which I can honestly not say about 4e...and considering D&D next and Scott Rouse's opinion, looks like I got my wish...). But if it is the former...D&D Next will be my second Go-To game after AD&D.

 

[Ranes]

I think that calling 3e and 3.5 different editions is pushing it. Using anything from 3.0 in 3.5 or vice-versa is possible with nearly (or absolutely) zero effort.

Anyway, it does not matter to me how long an edition lasts. I played 1e from 78-95 and I've played 3.x from 2001 to the present. Though I'm no advocate of 4e, the reason I didn't move on had more to do with me being very happy with what I already had than concerns with the new system.

I upgrade technology, because when new tech comes along it usually presents significant improvements over what came before (though not necessarily). Old tech physically breaks down and needs to be replaced, at which point the newer tech may be the only or obvious choice. RPGs aren't inevitably like that, I submit.

 

[Umbran]

I only have so many hours a week I can play or run games. I have vastly more gaming materials on my shelves than I require for my immediate needs, including some games that have been on my shelf for years, but I haven't yet had an opportunity to run. I daresay I have enough gaming content to keep me entertained for the rest of my natural lifespan, and then some.

Does that mean I'm not going to get other games? Heck no! I'm a hobbyist - an RPG hobbyist, not a D&D Xth Edition hobbyist. I'm interested in new games, period.

 

[Ranes]

I'm interested in new games, full stop. That does not equate to being inclined to pick up every edition of game x.

 

[the Jester]

So 5e is on the way. WotC is looking to avoid the mistakes of 4e. They've got a good team. They've got the brand. However, they've got a huge target to hit and 4e will have the briefest lifespan in the brand's history amongst a fractured fan base.

And we already see the love for the Edition Treadmill in play...

I'd say rather, the love for improving the game- something rpg players have a long tradition of doing through house rules and homebrews. It's the natural extension, with an edition that has caused so much division and contention.

A week ago, however, for the 4e fans, it was still the best edition of the game ever made.

So for the 4e fans that are now ready to move to 5e, how did the announcement change things? Why?

First of all, I think a lot of 4e fans acknowledge that 4e is not the "best ever"- perhaps there is no one best ever. 4e fans will usually point to certain elements (monster design is one of my favorites) as "the best D&D has ever done X", while 2e did Y best and OD&D did Z best. 4e has the advantage of being the newest, getting current support and having a lot of neat new bells & whistles.

Which isn't to say that there aren't those who like 4e better than any other edition, just to point out that it's not always (perhaps even not usually) quite that simple

Anyway, nobody is really ready to move to 5e yet since it isn't out and we haven't seen it, but I think anticipation is high because we've all had enough time to see 4e's warts and bunions as well as its firm high breasts and pretty eyes. We like the idea of taking "the best of everything" and making it work. Personally, I have a wall of D&D books that are old edition products that I use for flavor, pics and inspiration; it would be awesome if I could also pull some mechanics straight out of them. I love to read new rules systems and play new games, and even if 5e turns out to be pretty boring and homely, I'll be interested in seeing it.

Did the announcement of 5e suddenly show you that those 4e critics were right all along?

No- some criticisms are valid and some are just reactionary; some point out real flaws in the game and some are just badwrongfunisms. Nothing has changed here, at least for me.

I don't understand the desire for a new edition for games that haven't been out even 5 years.

To improve the game.

Yes, I'm happy with 4e, but if a 5e came out that re-unified the D&D base, I'd be ecstatic. If the game is better, the game is better, period. (Read "better" as "better for my group" in this case.)

Honestly, I'm weary of it. I love Pathfinder, but if Paizo threw it over for a 2e tomorrow, I wouldn't be making the switch. I don't want it. I certainly don't need it. One day, of course I'll be ready for a PF 2e. But that day is far, far down the road.

No gun to your head etc etc; I am sure you've heard the old cliche before.

 

[TwinBahamut]

A week ago, however, for the 4e fans, it was still the best edition of the game ever made.

So for the 4e fans that are now ready to move to 5e, how did the announcement change things? Why?

Did the announcement of 5e suddenly show you that those 4e critics were right all along?

I think this is completely the wrong way to look at it...

I don't play an edition of D&D because it is "perfect" or "the one true edition" or something like that. I play it because it is "good enough" or "better than the alternatives". No edition of D&D so far has been perfect, or even remotely close to perfect. Honestly, I'm not even sure if I can say any edition of D&D that I've played has been objectively good. Despite that core spark of something potentially great, they have all had flaws, and all needed improvement in fundamental ways. 4E was much better than 3E in many ways, but it was still flawed in its own ways.

What's more, I've been aware of the flaws of 4E and the need for an eventual 5E from the moment 4E was released. The announcement of 5E hasn't changed my opinion of 4E at all, just as the announcement of 4E didn't changed my opinion of 3E.

The edition treadmill continues on, and will forever continue on, simply because perfection is both impossible to achieve yet a goal to strive for. Each edition is a step towards it, but no game will ever be so good that it is beyond improvement and innovation.

 

[Desdichado]

What 'short' lifespan? If, as seems likely right now, 5e (or whatever WotC calls it) is actually launched at GenCon 2013, 4e lasted 5 years. Just like 3.5, and longer than 3.0. TSR AD&D edition lifespans were really long, but that was an anomaly even for TSR; OD&D -> AD&D was five years, too.

If you're going to count 3.5 and 3e as different editions, then you also need to count 4e and Essentials as different editions. And probably 2e and Skills & Powers as two different editions too.

Then you can say, yeah, it's not a short lifetime. But otherwise, the 4e lifespan was the shortest of any edition by a large amount.