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Converting Planescape monsters

Cleon

Legend
Whew! Both original versions have immunity to cold, so we should add that. Also::devil:

Yes, they ought to have immunity to cold & fire vulnerability if we're sticking close to the original.

If forced to choose between "explodes when killed by fire" and "explodes in above-Zero temperature" I'd choose the former.

How about "explodes when killed in an above-freezing temperature (which always occurs if it is slain by fire damage)."?
 

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freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
I can go with that. Should the explosion have the radius of the chilling aura and damage of the blast? I'm not too fond of the d4/HD and would rather have a set number per size/age category.
 

Cleon

Legend
I can go with that. Should the explosion have the radius of the chilling aura and damage of the blast? I'm not too fond of the d4/HD and would rather have a set number per size/age category.

Hmm, the original monster does a good deal more damage with the "Death Throes" than a "Chill Blast" - 6d4 to 12d4 is roughly 175-350% as much as 2d6.

The area does match that of the "Chill Aura" though.

How about having the Death Throes do double the Chill Blast damage with the Chill Aura radius of effect?

Will we give it a Reflex save for half damage as per most explosion-type attacks?
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Yes, and yes.

Death Throes (Su): When an ash quasi-elemental dies in above-freezing temperatures (which always occurs if it is slain by fire damage), it explodes doing the amount of cold damage listed to all creatures in range. A successful Reflex save halves the damage.

Size of Ash
Quasi-Elemental
RadiusCold
Damage
Reflex
Save
Small5 ft.2d6DC 12
Medium10 ft.2d8DC 14
Large20 ft.4d6DC 17
Huge30 ft.4d8DC 21
Greater30 ft.6d6DC 24
Elder30 ft.6d8DC 27
Monolith40 ft.8d6DC 35
 

Cleon

Legend
Yes, and yes.

Death Throes (Su): When an ash quasi-elemental dies in above-freezing temperatures (which always occurs if it is slain by fire damage), it explodes doing the amount of cold damage listed to all creatures in range. A successful Reflex save halves the damage.

Size of Ash
Quasi-Elemental
RadiusCold
Damage
Reflex
Save
Small5 ft.2d6DC 12
Medium10 ft.2d8DC 14
Large20 ft.4d6DC 17
Huge30 ft.4d8DC 21
Greater30 ft.6d6DC 24
Elder
30 ft.6d8DC 27
Monolith
40 ft.8d6DC 35

Works for me!

Updating the Ash Quasi-Elemental Working Draft.

Are we making it a spread or a burst? I'm thinking burst, as it's described as an explosion.
 



freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
Sure!

The original critter lists 1d6+(HD-dependent bonus) for the attack damage, but I'm not certain if that's cold or bludgeoning damage. Taking the lead from the fire elemental, I'd probably have it do a bit of normal damage and a bit of cold. Start at 1d4/1d4 like the fire elemental?
 

Cleon

Legend

Updating the Ash Quasi-Elemental Working Draft.

The original critter lists 1d6+(HD-dependent bonus) for the attack damage, but I'm not certain if that's cold or bludgeoning damage. Taking the lead from the fire elemental, I'd probably have it do a bit of normal damage and a bit of cold. Start at 1d4/1d4 like the fire elemental?

The Ash Quasi has "If the ash quasielemental actually touches a sod in combat, its heat drain inflicts 1d6 points of damage plus 1 additional point per Hit Die of the elemental creature (6, 9, or 12)", which means it's the same draining effect as its Aura or Blast.

A direct translation would be it's a cold damage touch attack.

An AD&D Fire Elementals' writeup specifies their attacks still damage "fire creature" (but at -1 damage per die) while burning inflammable targets.

Hmm...

I don't much like the idea of giving it a cold damage only attack, because it'd mean they would be unable to harm a coldproofed opponent.

A slam attack with an energy rider would seem the best solution to that, like the Fire Elemental.

However, I also thought we'd agreed to give it a touch attack. I suppose we could give it a fire-elemental damage scaled touch attack, or maybe even both?

e.g. something like:

Large Ash Quasi-Elemental #1: 2 slams +8 melee (2d6+5 plus 2d6 cold)
Large Ash Quasi-Elemental #2: 2 touches +8 touch (4d6 cold)
Large Ash Quasi-Elemental #3: 2 slams +8 melee (2d6+5 plus 2d6 cold) and touches +8 touch (4d6 cold)​

Hmm, I don't like the way that does more damage than a 3E Fire Elemental - the original averaged about the same (9.5 to 15.5 for 6 HD to 12 HD Ashes vs 13.5 for an AD&D Fire Elemental). I think we should reduce the slam damage, either the Bludgeoning or the Cold component or both.

The Ash Quasi's greater strength also adds significantly to the damage, especially at the smaller sizes. If we use the fire elemental's damage dice we'd have:

Small: Fire (1d4 plus 1d4 fire) vs Ash (1d4+3 plus 1d4 cold) = 5 vs 8.
Medium: Fire (1d6+1 plus 1d6 fire) vs Ash (1d6+4 plus 1d6 cold) = 8 vs 11.​

I think we'd better reduce the Ash Quasi's Strength by 2 to diminish this damage difference.

Playing around with the numbers, I think we'd by OK if we cut one of the damages down a "half step" (e.g. 2d6 to 1d10) and lower the Strength by 2.

That'd give us:

Size of ElementalFire Elemental
Ash
Quasi-Elemental
Fire vs Ash
Small1d4 plus 1d4 fire1d3+1 plus 1d4 cold5 vs 5.5
Medium1d6+1 plus 1d6 fire1d4+3 plus 1d6 cold8 vs 9
Large2d6+2 plus 2d6 fire1d10+4 plus 2d6 cold16 vs 16.5
Huge2d8+4 plus 2d8 fire2d6+6 plus 2d8 cold22 vs 22
Greater2d8+5 plus 2d8 fire2d6+7 plus 2d8 cold23 vs 23
Elder2d8+6 plus 2d8 fire2d6+8 plus 2d8 cold24 vs 24
Monolith6d6+11/19–20 plus 4d6 fire4d8+13/19–20 plus 4d6 cold32 vs 31
 

freyar

Extradimensional Explorer
I honestly can't remember talking about touch attacks, and I'm feeling too lazy to go look. :p

But I think the conversion to slam + cold fits best with how the fire elemental got converted, and the damage table you propose looks pretty good to me.
 

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