D&D 5E Magic Item Costs in 5E

[Chocolategravy]

I still wouldn't call it ludicrous. They're not meant to be played together but even if you do, that's roughly seven or eight levels worth of XP. Is it really so ludicrous to have that many items split amongst five PC's and gained over 7-8 levels?

10 items, any one of which "only the wealthiest nobles could afford". Yes, that is ludicrous. The supply is obviously far too high for it to fit that sort of description of their worth. To match "only the wealthiest nobles could afford" would put maybe 8 items in the hands of the party, if they're lucky, by level 20 after years of questing. Not at level 7 after days. Said nobles with literal armies at their disposal would have vacuumed up all these items long before wasting their time on such poor sources of money as gold mines or other noble's land.

 

[tom.zunder]

Earthdawn has items that awaken and develop magical powers in the hands of their attuned owners, I always liked that.

 

[CapnZapp]

How many GP does the average noble actually have? What about the wealthiest?

I'm guessing it's not nearly as much as many of us might think.

A regular country noble wouldn't have much in the way of what we call "cash", no. But owning a handful of villages and a dozen hamlets, i.e. the output of hundreds of people, will add up. I imagine such a noble could easily fund or borrow 1,000 gp.

Being a powerful ruler in a great metropolis of tens of thousands of inhabitants would amount to a "net worth" of perhaps 100,000 gp.

Think of a high level spellcaster with the backing of a country-spanning church or guild and we're talking 1,000,000 gp, easy.

Too many fantasy games simply ignore economics of scale. While it is understandable that game designers are only fantasy gamers with little to no understanding of economics (or they'd be in a different business than rpgs! ) it is still inexcusable to present a church catering for thousands and expect players to find "we have a grand total of two (2) healing potions" as anything resembling the believable.

I realize it is boring and "too much like work" to add up the number of pigs, smithies and properties that make up any settlement. But if you think about it for even a few minutes, you'd quickly realize that the sums (if only in the books assuming a non-cash civilization) involved are pretty huge (compared to what a low-level adventurer carries in his pocket).

It is the same with the reality-defying claim that even low-level magic items should be "purchasable only by the wealthiest of nobles".

Sheesh, if anything, if the noble can't buy the item for money, he can buy people for money.

Meaning that if I am a rich merchant desiring your magical sword, how much do you think it would cost me to hire twice the mercenaries of double your level to kill you and take your stuff?

Far less than what my offer to purchase your item and let you live in peace, that's why.

TL;DR: If the game doesn't want PCs to buy magic stuff from Walmart, that's fine. But don't pretend as if there wouldn't be some kind of magic item economy in a highly magical society like those of Forgotten Realms, say.

Not providing any guidelines only means not helping DMs with what they then must do themselves, with all the risks of unbalancing and errors that entails.

 

[Pandamonium87]

I'd love an item creation system which requires rare components (like gems or herbs) an specific spells rather than a money-based one

 

[EroGaki]

I'd love an item creation system which requires rare components (like gems or herbs) an specific spells rather than a money-based one

This.

I like the idea of questing/searching for rare items, combined with the right spells to create a magic item. What I don't want to see is what they did in 2e, which took the concept and blew it waaaayy out of proportion; I'm not spending a 2 years of real life game time to make a +1 dagger.

Likewise, I also like the idea of magic items being spontaneously created through heroic or epic events.

 

[Mr Fixit]

I just did this last night in my own game. Our fighter uses a two-handed flail (reskinned maul). I could never find a legit reason to have a magical two-handed flail lying around.

But then I realized I'd put a chain devil in the adventure, and she (the fighter) was using an oil to make her weapon temporarily magic. I just decided the chain devil's lifeblood reacted with the oil and bestowed a permanent magic on the weapon. Now it's a +1 flail where she can spend a bonus action to change its length, granting her reach at the expense of some damage.

Now this is a neat idea!

 

[Werebat]

But don't you think the DMG should give you suggested values of these items so you have some frame of refrence for your campaign, I mean if there is a gold piece value for warships, towers, castles, slaves, and all kinds of other things shouldn't the game system give you an idea of what a +1 sword is worth to a young noble, or a holy avenger is worth to a church, a crystal ball to the spymaster?

Once the game does this, it opens the door to munchkinism. Optimisers will scan through the whole list of magic items and create "Bunko's Bargain Basement" lists of "must have" items that are a "steal" due to high power/price ratios. Certain items will always be sold off for cash because they are "worth" more than they are worth.

And so on.

 

[Werebat]

I'd love an item creation system which requires rare components (like gems or herbs) an specific spells rather than a money-based one

Sounds good until the players think about it and start pestering the DM about what can be crafted with the remains of Every. Single. Thing. they come across in the game. And then try to sell all of the dragon parts they don't intend to use.

 

[Jan van Leyden]

I just did this last night in my own game. Our fighter uses a two-handed flail (reskinned maul). I could never find a legit reason to have a magical two-handed flail lying around.

But then I realized I'd put a chain devil in the adventure, and she (the fighter) was using an oil to make her weapon temporarily magic. I just decided the chain devil's lifeblood reacted with the oil and bestowed a permanent magic on the weapon. Now it's a +1 flail where she can spend a bonus action to change its length, granting her reach at the expense of some damage.

How Earthdawnish! Spinning this idea further and extending it to magic items found sounds like a good idea. So you have pried the morningstar from the dead hands of the orc chieftain, who made awesome things with it in the fight against the adventurers. But in your hands, it just seems to be a normal weapon without any sepcial abilities, even though it registers as magic.

Now, if you learn the history of the morningstar or that of its previous wielders' special fights, which made it magical, you gain a powerfull wepaon. But alas! The magical aura of the morningstar gets weaker and weaker, so you better hurry to find it out.

 

[Blackbrrd]

A regular country noble wouldn't have much in the way of what we call "cash", no. But owning a handful of villages and a dozen hamlets, i.e. the output of hundreds of people, will add up. I imagine such a noble could easily fund or borrow 1,000 gp.

Being a powerful ruler in a great metropolis of tens of thousands of inhabitants would amount to a "net worth" of perhaps 100,000 gp.

Think of a high level spellcaster with the backing of a country-spanning church or guild and we're talking 1,000,000 gp, easy.

Too many fantasy games simply ignore economics of scale. While it is understandable that game designers are only fantasy gamers with little to no understanding of economics (or they'd be in a different business than rpgs! ) it is still inexcusable to present a church catering for thousands and expect players to find "we have a grand total of two (2) healing potions" as anything resembling the believable.

I realize it is boring and "too much like work" to add up the number of pigs, smithies and properties that make up any settlement. But if you think about it for even a few minutes, you'd quickly realize that the sums (if only in the books assuming a non-cash civilization) involved are pretty huge (compared to what a low-level adventurer carries in his pocket).

It is the same with the reality-defying claim that even low-level magic items should be "purchasable only by the wealthiest of nobles".

Sheesh, if anything, if the noble can't buy the item for money, he can buy people for money.

Meaning that if I am a rich merchant desiring your magical sword, how much do you think it would cost me to hire twice the mercenaries of double your level to kill you and take your stuff?

Far less than what my offer to purchase your item and let you live in peace, that's why.

TL;DR: If the game doesn't want PCs to buy magic stuff from Walmart, that's fine. But don't pretend as if there wouldn't be some kind of magic item economy in a highly magical society like those of Forgotten Realms, say.

Not providing any guidelines only means not helping DMs with what they then must do themselves, with all the risks of unbalancing and errors that entails.

Actually, to have a magic item economy, there would have to be some volume of magic item transactions. Without it, the price of the magic items would be really situational. I think 5e assumes the latter. Because of this, there isn't any sense in setting the "list price" of a magic item.

I do agree that there sure is going to be some magic item trading, but I don't think there would be any magic item shops lying around. If you look back in history, clothes were all made to order, or home-made.

Now, looking at a +1 weapon. For a noble hiring soldiers, it makes more sense to hire two men with regular swords, than one guy with a +1 weapon (if the men were otherwise equally skilled). In this sense, a +1 item is more like a luxery item that the noble might want to have for himself. Not something you equip your army with. For an adventurer, it might have a much greater value, but it's hard to find someone having a spare +1 weapon.

Now, I think that adventurers wanting to sell magic items should be able to sell them, but depending on the situation, the price could be rediculessly low, or really high depending on the demand for magic items.

Btw, as far as I know, there aren't any magic item creation rules for permanent magic items? Only for consumables? In which case, the only magic items around are just circulated around, especially when adventurers start poking around. If the PC's want to sell that +1 item, they better find a noble that doesn't have one already, and actually wants one. Otherwise, they might sell it to a wealthy merchant who doesn't want it for himself, but for trade, but I would think the price should be a lot lower then.

Btw, regarding the economy of scale, sure he has a lot of income, but usually, he has to use most of it to pay his men, keep is castle from collapsing, etc. The money he has left ofter is something he might want to spend on other luxury items like food or clothes or whatever.