D&D 3E/3.5 Thoughts of a 3E/4E powergamer on starting to play 5E

[Imaro]

Not metagame means you don't use knowledge/info the character doesn't have.

Yes I know what not metagaming is... what I am looking for is how this is carried out in practice as opposed to theoretically? Let's start with a simple question... How do you choose which monster you will attack when playing a DMPC?

 

[pemerton]

in 5E, the assumed story is allowed to influence the combat rules in ways that it wasn't in 4E.

I'm not sure I follow this.

Two examples from 4e:

Come and Get It: the goons charge the Conan-esque (or Jet Li-esque) fighter, who cuts them down as they come adjacent. That looks like a combat rule that has been influenced by the assumed story.

Valiant Smite: the paladin becomes more likely to hit the more foes surround him/her. That also looks like a combat rule that has been influenced by the assumed story.

If an instance of "assumed story" in 5e is Fireball as a signature spell, I'm not sure how 4e differs - classes had signature moves, and signature orientations more generally (in virtue of "role" mechanics, preferred stats, etc).

5e's design focus seems to be more on the character's role in the game 'world' over what he can DO in said world.

<snip>

As you proceed through character creation in 5e, there are a lot of questions asked to help a new player create a persona. When they pick a race or class, there are suggestions as to why they became a Ranger, or where they got their Wizard training.

<snip>

In my experience, 4e gives you a paragraph about your class

Again, this doesn't fit with my experience with 4e - each class entry in the PHB, for instance, has an outline of the class's typical outlook(s), a discussion of how members of that class relate to various gods and are found among various races, etc. And each race entry has 3 vignettes illustrating how a member of that race might become an adventurer of some class or other, with some goal/focus or other.

I'm not sure exactly what distinction you are drawing between a PC's role and what a PC can do - "role" is a word that overlaps in meaning with words like "office", "function", "position" etc, which are all about what a person does, or is permitted/expected to do. But anyway, the 5e classes seem to me to be set out in ways quite similar to 4e ones - proficiency lists (for amour, weapons and skills), save proficiencies (replacing defence bonuses), and then lists of abilities by level.

What is innovative in 5e (from the D&D perspective - not from the perspective of RPGing more genrally) is the personality/inspiration system.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

I just re-read the passages you quoted... were they speaking to a player being a "hero" or were they discussing the roleplaying of a hero as a character in the game (and the characteristics they believe define one)? To me at least it seemed to be the latter...

The issue is that the passages in question weren't talking about people who fit the description of D&D PCs.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

Yes I know what not metagaming is... what I am looking for is how this is carried out in practice as opposed to theoretically? Let's start with a simple question... How do you choose which monster you will attack when playing a DMPC?

Roleplaying. You put yourself in the character shoes, and you act as that character would act based on who they are and what that character sees. I would think this would be obvious.

 

[Imaro]

The issue is that the passages in question weren't talking about people who fit the description of D&D PCs.

Ok, I'll bite... what is the universal description of D&D PC's??

 

[Imaro]

Roleplaying. You put yourself in the character shoes, and you act as that character would act based on who they are and what that character sees. I would think this would be obvious.

Again... I am asking for practical examples of how this is done. How does "roleplaying" tell you which of the 3 goblin wolf riders or 2 hobgoblins to attack? If you don't want to give a practical answer then that's fine, just say so but you've avoided every single question I've asked about this.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

Again... I am asking for practical examples of how this is done. How does "roleplaying" tell you which of the 3 goblin wolf riders or 2 hobgoblins to attack? If you don't want to give a practical answer then that's fine, just say so but you've avoided every single question I've asked about this.

Most of the time you would be just talking about basic tactics. If the character is a tank, you'd attack the enemy center. If you're playing a more glass cannon sort of melee, you'd try to match up 1 on 1 against somebody on the flank. If you're ranged, you target whoever looks the most vulnerable. It's just tactics 101. Certain personality traits/quirks may modify this. I covered this above when I said acting based on what the character sees, and who they are.

As for metagaming, you just don't do it. It isn't any more complicated than that. Sure as the DM you have the ability and means to do so, you just use your self control and choose not to do so.

 

[jayoungr]

I'm not sure I follow this.

I meant story flavor was allowed to take precedence over balance, and/or that flavorful but unbalance-able (because extremely swingy) abilities were put into 5E. Neither of the examples you mentioned from 4E affect that edition's legendary balance.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

Ok, I'll bite... what is the universal description of D&D PC's??

D&D PCs are exceptional compared to the populace at large. They have abilities not possessed by average civilians that allow them to overcome and survive the adversity thrown against D&D PCs.

 

[thecasualoblivion]

I meant story flavor was allowed to take precedence over balance, and/or that flavorful but unbalance-able (because extremely swingy) abilities were put into 5E. Neither of the examples you mentioned from 4E affect that edition's legendary balance.

That is shifting the goalposts. You are talking about balance being a bad thing, not about story.