D&D 5E DM Help! My rogue always spams Hide as a bonus action, and i cant target him!

[Hriston]

You are correct. 'Hiding' (as in passing a stealth vs perception check while meeting the conditions to hide - not clearly seen) does not remove any knowledge from the observer. If you hide, then don't move, and your observer has no reason to believe you've moved and reason to believe you could not have moved then he knows your location. But until he does something to reveal you (such as move and look in the box) then you are still 'hidden' (unheard and unseen...not observer has forgotten you exist)

When something reveals your position, two things happen: 1) your location is known, and 2) you are no longer hidden. Coincidence? I don't think so.

 

[kalil]

Don't be daft. Wood elves and lightfoots can stay hidden anywhere other races can, plus they can also stay hidden in their respective racial hiding places. No additional condition need be met.

Errr. No? That is absolutely not what the ability says. "You can attempt to hide even when you are only lightly obscured by natural foliage, heavy rain, falling snow, mist, or other similar conditions." It is absolutely 100% clear that it indicates the act of _becoming_ hidden not _staying_ hidden.

 

[ThePolarBear]

Don't be daft. Wood elves and lightfoots can stay hidden anywhere other races can, plus they can also stay hidden in their respective racial hiding places. No additional condition need be met.

Except the part where "attempt to" is mentioned clearly and has to be changed to something else to fit your interpretation to make your interpretation consistent.

When something reveals your position, two things happen: 1) your location is known, and 2) you are no longer hidden. Coincidence? I don't think so.

No. When something reveals your position, something reveals your position. The second part is added by you by default by assuming that that is always true. The rules do not make this assumption and simply leave the matter to the dm to judge. And even if that something actually reveals your position and makes you no longer hidden, it's THAT SOMETHING and not the fact that your location is known that makes you no longer hidden: It has to be one of the things that make you no longer hidden. Like being seen, no longer being unheard, being discovered or stop hiding; if you are moving staying out of cover or moving swiftly and i guess a couple that i'm too much in a hurry right now to go back and check yet another time.

 

[Plaguescarred]

Don't be daft. Wood elves and lightfoots can stay hidden anywhere other races can, plus they can also stay hidden in their respective racial hiding places. No additional condition need be met.

Not just remain hidden but try to hide as well is what you fail to understand or accept. Additional condition is if as you say these features can only be used when obscured in their respective fashion while not seen byn prying eyes starring at them, then its additional conditions since anyone can try to hide when not seen anyway!!

Let's read again: ''Naturally Stealthy and Mask of the Wild—do allow members of those subraces to try to hide in their special circumstances even when observers are nearby. Normally, you can’t hide from someone if you’re in full view. A lightfoot halfling, though, can try to vanish behind a creature that is at least one size larger, and a wood elf can try to hide simply by being in heavy rain, mist, falling snow, foliage, or similar natural phenomena.”

 

[Maxperson]

Don't be daft. Wood elves and lightfoots can stay hidden anywhere other races can, plus they can also stay hidden in their respective racial hiding places. No additional condition need be met.

It does not say "stay hidden". It says "try to hide".

 

[ClearlyTough69]

The Goblin doesn't have to hide to get the advantage on his next bow attack. Merely being unseen gives him this advantage.

I don't read the rules this way. If the goblin doesn't hide, it will automatically be seen as it comes round the cover to shoot its bow. To have a chance of being unseen when it shoots, it must hide first.

Once it's hidden, I know that many DMs rule that it automatically gets advantage on its attack. Personally, I give the target a chance to spot the goblin as it edges/ leaps out of cover (passive Perception with disadvantage if it doesn't realise the goblin's there, straight passive Perception if it saw the goblin go into that hiding place). If the target spots the goblin, they do so before it attacks so the attack loses advantage.

 

[Maxperson]

Not just remain hidden but try to hide as well is what you fail to understand or accept. Additional condition is if as you say these features can only be used when obscured in their respective fashion while not seen byn prying eyes starring at them, then its additional conditions since anyone can try to hide when not seen anyway!!

Let's read again: ''Naturally Stealthy and Mask of the Wild—do allow members of those subraces to try to hide in their special circumstances even when observers are nearby. Normally, you can’t hide from someone if you’re in full view. A lightfoot halfling, though, can try to vanish behind a creature that is at least one size larger, and a wood elf can try to hide simply by being in heavy rain, mist, falling snow, foliage, or similar natural phenomena.”

It also goes out of its way to say that "Normally, you can't hide from someone if you're in full view.", which means that it's talking about A) hiding while in full view, and B) doing something abnormal when using the abilities. Specific beats general.

 

[Krachek]

Not just remain hidden but try to hide as well is what you fail to understand or accept. Additional condition is if as you say these features can only be used when obscured in their respective fashion while not seen byn prying eyes starring at them, then its additional conditions since anyone can try to hide when not seen anyway!!

Let's read again: ''Naturally Stealthy and Mask of the Wild—do allow members of those subraces to try to hide in their special circumstances even when observers are nearby. Normally, you can’t hide from someone if you’re in full view. A lightfoot halfling, though, can try to vanish behind a creature that is at least one size larger, and a wood elf can try to hide simply by being in heavy rain, mist, falling snow, foliage, or similar natural phenomena.”

The question is :
By moving closer can we see the halfling or the elf?
Falling snow can provide some shadow at distance, by at 5 feet, not really.
Same thing for the halfling. He can hide being the paladin. But he you turn around the paladin and negate the cover, do you see him, or need succeed a perception check?

 

[ThePolarBear]

The question is :
By moving closer can we see the halfling or the elf?
Falling snow can provide some shadow at distance, by at 5 feet, not really.
Same thing for the halfling. He can hide being the paladin. But he you turn around the paladin and negate the cover, do you see him, or need succeed a perception check?

As per normal rules for hiding if you are discovered you are no longer hidden. It applies to LH (source of obscuration no longer applies > no longer obscured > clearly seen > no longer hidden) and for the WE (If he is no longer in a lightly obscured environment due to natural causes > no longer obscured > clearly seen > no longer hidden).
This, however, does not mean that simply moving NEAR a target is enough to make it no longer hidden, even if they are not really invisible, as much as getting right beside a closet with a person inside means that the person is no longer hidden, if it was hiding. Bumping into a WE is enough to make him no longer hidden, as is moving behind the creature providing obscurement for a LH. Or removing foliage from the area or shoving the creature the LH is hiding behind away. It is a "supernatural" ability that follow "supernatural" rules that are only required to make as much sense as casting a spell does in relation to our reality and its rules.
It's not about having shadows or not. It's about that particular situation that providing obscurement. Not shadows, not cover, just enough obscurement to be able to hide. Making one unable to be seen clearly enough.

For me: Yes, an umbrella would be enough to remove the requirement for the WE at least regarding atmospheric events

Quick edit: The rule "dm judges when it's possibl eto hide" still applies however. If for you it's not possible for a WE to hide 5ft away from a creature because there's not enough obscurement in the rain that is pouring on the combat ground then there's not enough rain for the WE to hide. And that's it.

 

[Uller]

The question is :
By moving closer can we see the halfling or the elf?
Falling snow can provide some shadow at distance, by at 5 feet, not really.
Same thing for the halfling. He can hide being the paladin. But he you turn around the paladin and negate the cover, do you see him, or need succeed a perception check?

IMO, If the obscurement is removed then the hiding character is no longer hidden. To me, this is what makes these abilities balanced and interesting. Often the hider has to choose to hide or move to a safer place or the observer must choose to spend an action searching or simply move (to a potentially more dangerous position) to reveal the hider.



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