D&D 5E the dex warrior - why make a strength based one?

[Mephista]

I tend to think the goal was to appeal to women, who stereotypically prefer lithe dexterous archers over strong melee brutes. It's a kind of hypercorrection to the old rule where female characters had a lower strength cap than males.

This is pretty bad stereotyping. Women players have just as wide a variety of Strength-based warriors, Dex-based anything, or casters as any male player. Its hard to argue that women -characters- tend to be more dex based (or caster), but that's more of a sexist stereotype that runs in popular culture than actual play.

Gender / sex has nothing to do with the game design. Did the designers want to make Dex characters viable without some kind of tax or MAD requriements? Absolutely. Did male/female enter into it? No. Sometimes, people just want to play a Dex character over a Str one, and vice versa.

 

[Ancalagon]

Ara ara. The "Dex is ultimately superior to Str" argument again. The only way to tell is to actually run the game and see. Game balance shifts depending on the game.

Now back to your regularly scheduled fun.

I blame thread necromancy for this.

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[UngeheuerLich]

You are right. Dex is the god stat in 5e. The best solutions imo: (i) no finesse weapons (all melee weapons use Str) and no crossbow expert feat (ie no way of eliminating disad if the archer gets caught in melee). Then both Str weapons and Dex ranged attackers have their usefulness/place.

I am sure finesse weapons are generally no problem. Maybe the rapier. The problem which may arise is that archers on an open field are doing too much damage by focus fire on long range.

 

[CapnZapp]

Ara ara. The "Dex is ultimately superior to Str" argument again. The only way to tell is to actually run the game and see. Game balance shifts depending on the game.

Now back to your regularly scheduled fun.

Apologies but this completely misses the point.

The game has been playtested and melee has been found wanting.

This discussion is about recognizing this fact so we can hope WotC will course correct.

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[Robyo]

So you can make the goliath barbarian of your dreams with a greataxe, that's why. d12 hit die, d12 damage die

 

[jgsugden]

The game has been tested and some people find melee wanting. Others find it to be more than acceptable. There are many that don't want to risk what might happen if they try to fix what is not broken.

I've played warlocks, wizards, paladins, monks, rangers, fighters, sorcerers, druids and barbarians in campaigns in 5e. I've played high level PCs and low level PCs. I've also played a wide variety of classes in 4e, 3.5, 3e, Pathfinder, 2e, AD&D, the old boxed sets, other. RPGs and a variety of D&D mini games. I've played in 5 different decades. My best estimate is that I've gamed for over 12,000 hours and spent another 8,000 preparing for games and visiting forums, etc... That is about 2.25 years of my life (ignoring sleep) that has been spent enjoying RPGs with hundreds of friends.

IMO: 5E is the best system I've played for a traditional fantasy RPG experience - by far. Is it perfect? No. What is? However, it is so good that we don't need to nitpick the rules because they all work. Every class is fun. Everyone gets a time to shine. Don't take this amazing game for granted.

 

[procproc]

IME, it's not the +Dex to ranged damage that makes a mess of things, it's adding +Dex to initiative.

I'm okay with archers getting their chance to shine on a big open battlefield; that happens rarely enough (compared to fighting in 30'x30' dungeon rooms) that it feels reasonable. I'm even okay with them getting a fairly hefty bonus to Dex saves in exchange for losing out on a point of AC. What feels really terrible is that a character with a +4 bonus to a roll (e.g., 20 Dex vs. 12) rolls equal or better 70% of the time. Since the higher Dex mod goes first, that means the Dex fighter gets to act first (and often just act *more*) than a Str fighter, which feels pretty bad.

 

[cmad1977]

It's a non problem made a problem by people who can't handle their games.


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[Arilyn]

It's a non problem made a problem by people who can't handle their games.



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DEX is overpowered. Discussing problems in games ultimately help make our games better. Designers want to know what needs fixing, and players enjoy discussing solutions amongst themselves. DEX does too much. It's a great combat stat. Using two light weapons means you can compete with the large two-handed weapons, and you get two chances to hit. Add in the right fighting style or feat and you can add your DEX bonus to both weapons' damage. You can now add your DEX bonus to ranged combat damage. It also is used for many adventuring skills, it adds to initiative, and is a very common saving throw. I have definitely seen an increase in DEX characters over STR in my games. Even players who are not min/maxers are lured in by the many treats DEX gives. STR is not "vastly" inferior but it is enough of a difference that it is a problem which needs to be addressed.

 

[CapnZapp]

This is pretty bad stereotyping.

Probably just best to drop the issue.

We wouldn't want the thread to derail in a gender discussion.