D&D 5E End-game gimmicks: the problem with 5e meta-plots

[Nevvur]

Can anyone familiar with modules from earlier editions comment on how frequently the 'problem' of gimmicks was in the past?

 

[Satyrn]

I much more like quests about saving the world from big evil than saving suzies cats from the cat eating monster living deep in the cave.

Save the Kittens!

 

[Ancalagon]

(meta-plots are also stretch credulity--the death curse would, in my campaign world, result in a few level 20 clerics, wizards, and paladins immediately appearing in Port Nyanzaru to address the problem).

This does bother me about this particular adventure. Why are they sending low-level novices instead of well proven, hardened problem solvers?

In some adventures it makes more sense - the PCs are dealing with a small problem, which grows and grows and by the time it's revealed that holy crap, this is *very bad*, the PCs have become the best placed and most capable people to deal with the problem. But ToA *starts* as a huge problem...

 

[Corpsetaker]

The best adventures are the ones I like to call "ice breakers", they are the ones that go from about level 1 to level 5. These are a great way to get players introduced into a world that will then allow the DM to create his own adventure for higher levels.

 

[CapnZapp]

I can't figure out how to do spoiler tags on this forum so I'll just say that in the published 5e adventures either the party receives substantial buffs or the end-boss is nerfed.

Use both SPOILER and SBLOCK together (one nested in the other).

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[CapnZapp]

This does bother me about this particular adventure. Why are they sending low-level novices instead of well proven, hardened problem solvers?

Because people like adventures starting at first level?


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[hawkeyefan]

Can anyone familiar with modules from earlier editions comment on how frequently the 'problem' of gimmicks was in the past?

Generally, I’d say that modules from the 1E or 2E eras don’t typically do this, mostly because (with a couple of exceptions) they didn’t often pit PCs against huge baddies like Demogorgon or Imix, etc.

3E was probably a little guilty of this at times, but not too often, I don’t think. The major example I can think of is the mini-campaign The Red Hand of Doom, which ends with a boss battle....but the PCs don’t fight the actual bad guy, but rather an “aspect” of the bad guy.

4E is the edition I’m least familiar with, but from what I have seen, it didn’t rely on such gimmicks. It is probably the edition that had the most end boss fights, but I think the game just went with the idea that a party of 28th level PCs could kill Orcus or Lolth or whoever. Someone more familiar with 4E may correct me on this.

This does bother me about this particular adventure. Why are they sending low-level novices instead of well proven, hardened problem solvers?

In some adventures it makes more sense - the PCs are dealing with a small problem, which grows and grows and by the time it's revealed that holy crap, this is *very bad*, the PCs have become the best placed and most capable people to deal with the problem. But ToA *starts* as a huge problem...

This is addressed in the adventure in a few ways. I won’t go into deatils for fear of spoiling things.

 

[pukunui]

I haven't really used any of the published adventures outside of LMoP and part of HotDQ. I own all of them but haven't read them. I played through CoS. What are these gimmicks you speak of?

There are things you can do to weaken Tiamat. You can get a bunch of legendary magic items that make it easier to defeat Strahd (but they aren't new to 5e; they were part of the original adventure too). You get some storm giant NPCs to help you defeat the BBEG in Storm King's Thunder. And you get some boons to help you defeat the BBEG in Tomb of Annihilation. PotA doesn't really have a gimmick that I can think of, and I guess OotA's gimmick is that you can play as the demon lords fighting each other until there's only one left standing for the PCs to fight.

 

[5ekyu]

There are things you can do to weaken Tiamat. You can get a bunch of legendary magic items that make it easier to defeat Strahd (but they aren't new to 5e; they were part of the original adventure too). You get some storm giant NPCs to help you defeat the BBEG in Storm King's Thunder. And you get some boons to help you defeat the BBEG in Tomb of Annihilation. PotA doesn't really have a gimmick that I can think of, and I guess OotA's gimmick is that you can play as the demon lords fighting each other until there's only one left standing for the PCs to fight.

Well, without going into specifics per product let me say that - for me - in general the types of things you describe include seeking out allies and winning their aide, seeking out special items to bypass various strengths or exploit weaknesses and quests to disrupt certain ongoing boosts etc and to me those are common tropes of heroic fiction and myth since heroes and myths existed.

That whole Medusa problem was not solved by just running in and slugging it out with bonus actions and well constructed feats? That medusa problem wa them the key to that whole giant monster problem, not stacking smites.

The very things you describe represent pulling together multiple/all the "pillars" of the adventure to be consequential in the eventual outcome.

is that now supposed to be a problem?

Did the vast preponderance or heroic legends and myths and stories have it wrong and it is just supposed to be about bigger plusses?

 

[FrogReaver]

Save the Kittens!

Save the kittens save the world?