D&D General Compelling and Differentiated Gameplay For Spellcasters and Martial Classes

[Tony Vargas]

That there's fiction where that happens doesn't mean that's the magic in fiction that D&D is modeling with it's spell casting mechanics.

Again, to be fair, as a model of magic in fiction, D&D is a dismal failure. It doesn't even model the science fiction of Vance's Dying Earth at all well.

Because we are trying to fix D&D and that's the kind of fiction it models

Once fixed, it will model fiction that sucks less, possibly even to the point of resembling the fantasy genre.

 

[FrogReaver]

Again, to be fair, as a model of magic in fiction, D&D is a dismal failure. It doesn't even model the science fiction of Vance's Dying Earth at all well.

It does a great job for the magic of fiction that it models - In an adventure the spellcaster is capable of casting spells with known effects when he wants them casted. D&D spellcasting models that very well. How on earth can you say it doesn't?

 

[Don Durito]

In this case I'm specifically talking about the fiction around spell casting. D&D does specifically model that and the fiction that's based on is incompatible with many of the proposals on this thread.

If you were being specific, you'd say what specific fiction you feel is being modelled here.

You seem to be being deliberately coy about this.
Give us authors and titles.

 

[FrogReaver]

If you were being specific, you'd say what specific fiction you feel is being modelled here.

You seem to be being deliberately coy about this.
Give us authors and titles.

How's this. Since you accuse me of being deliberately coy then how about I just don't answer anything you want me to answer. Respectful replies or nothing!

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

You can always add an ability check before the spell to represent the idea of the caster trying to harness magical forces. Something like:
Wizard, Intelligence(Arcana) check against a a DC 8+Spell level to be able to cast you spell. On a fail, you get to keep the spellslot, but the spell doesnt occur. On a fail by 10+, roll a d6 on the Magical Mishap Table:
1: Drain Lose HP equal to 5x the spell level.
2: Spellburn Lose the the spellslot as if the spell had been cast.
3: Backlash The mage is unable to cast leveled spell for 1d4 rounds.
4: Misfire The spell occur but target isnt the intented one.
5: Voidbound The mage become ethereal and cannot interact with the prime for 10 minute.
6: Harrowing As Voidbound, but the mage must also make a DC 15 Cha save or release 1d4 Shadows before entering the ethereal world.

You could have the clerics use religion, druids nature, bards performance and warlocks persuasion.

 

[Don Durito]

How's this. Since you accuse me of being deliberately coy then how about I just don't answer anything you want me to answer. Respectful replies or nothing!

Ok then. But perhaps tell the other people contributing to this thread so that this discussion can actually go somewhere.

Please?

 

[Tony Vargas]

If you were being specific, you'd say what specific fiction you feel is being modelled here.

He's just begging the question: D&D generates a certain sort of fiction, unlike any genre fiction.
Saying it 'models' the fiction it generates is like demonstrating marksmanship by shooting the broad side of a barn, then painting a bullseye around the hole.

 

[Don Durito]

He's just begging the question: D&D generates a certain sort of fiction, unlike any genre fiction.
Saying it 'models' that fiction is like demonstrating marksmanship by shooting the broad side of a barn, then painting a bullseye around the hole.

Perhaps. Without the actual texts in question we can't argue that he is wrong i.e. no one can disagree that D&D does a good job of modelling those texts.

But at the same time I don't see how anyone can be convinced of the opposite either.

It's a strange sort of cul de sac.

 

[FrogReaver]

He's just begging the question: D&D generates a certain sort of fiction, unlike any genre fiction.
Saying it 'models' the fiction it generates is like demonstrating marksmanship by shooting the broad side of a barn, then painting a bullseye around the hole.

Then your not understanding what I'm saying. No where has my argument been that D&D created a certain kind of fiction and then models it.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Then your not understanding what I'm saying. No where has my argument been that D&D created a certain kind of fiction and then models it.

Then what pre-existing fiction do you think D&D is modeling?