D&D General What Is Magic, Even?

[Umbran]

Magic... is an effect in the world when you don't know how it was accomplished.

Alternatively (and perhaps less cynically, and/or more spiritually) magic is an effect in the world brought about by ineffable means. This, in the original meaning of the word ineffable - a thing that cannot be expressed in words. If you can tell people, describe to them how a feat was accomplished, then it isn't magic.

 

[Salthorae]

I say that in part because RAW, a patron cannot take away what has been granted

RAW doesn't say that that I'm aware.

Really it doesn't say anything on the subject which is why there are endless debates online about if a warlock patron and revoke powers or not.

Any way you slice it - Magic is ineffable!

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Magic... is an effect in the world when you don't know how it was accomplished.

Alternatively (and perhaps less cynically, and/or more spiritually) magic is an effect in the world brought about by ineffable means. This, in the original meaning of the word ineffable - a thing that cannot be expressed in words. If you can tell people, describe to them how a feat was accomplished, then it isn't magic.

I dig that for divine magic, but for the magic of symbols and formula, I don’t think it holds up as well.

In my own world, Magic is loosely defined as those effects and phenomena which are only possible via the application of conscious Will, whether of a mortal or a spirit.

The Physical Magics are far from ineffable, and eventually are quantified to the point of integration with technology, but they still require a conscious Will to act upon the system.

The Spiritual Magics (divine magic, essentially) function differently, don’t always follow any rules or make sense, and can defy even the most fundamental physical laws. A fireball requires energy, gives off waste heat, takes slightly more energy out of the environment than it puts back in, etc, but a god can make fire from nothing.

 

[gyor]

Mike Mearls has said Wizardly magic is basically reality hacking.

 

[Tony Vargas]

The Physical Magics are far from ineffable, and eventually are quantified to the point of integration with technology, but they still require a conscious Will to act upon the system.

The Spiritual Magics (divine magic, essentially) function differently, don’t always follow any rules or make sense, and can defy even the most fundamental physical laws. A fireball requires energy, gives off waste heat, takes slightly more energy out of the environment than it puts back in, etc, but a god can make fire from nothing.

So that's the arcane/divine divide, that you were referring to, in the OP, when you said you weren't happy with D&D's handling of the divine?

 

[MechaTarrasque]

I figure it is energy/matter coming from one plane of reality to the next. Arcane magic comes from close planes (to the prime material): the ethereal, the feywild, the shadowfell, and the elemental planes. Some place (I think it was 4e) had the idea that wizards learned magic from fey (or elves retained some knowledge when the got kicked out of the 'wild).

Psychic magic comes from farther away (astral plane), so you can either access it (psychic) or not. It occurs to me that the Astral is closer to the feywild, so that might be why so much "mind messing" magic comes from there. So don't get too cocky about dominate this or charm that, you are getting it second hand.

Divine magic comes from the farthest out (Outer Planes), and you need help (either a god or to have a god's DNA in you) to get it. Of course, divine magic comes from little bags of magic with some personality attached (souls) coming up from the Inner Planes. so it's not a one-way flow.

Feypact and Dweller in the Deep warlocks are basically just arcane. The rest of them are just cheating. The 9 Hells are relatively close to the elemental planes, so the devils might be feeding the fiendpact warlock power from the Elemental Plane of Fire (and since they are fireproof, not caring what the natives think). For the GOOpact, who knows where a hole into the Far Realm might be located (maybe even inside an unsuspecting warlock).

That leaves "nature magic" or "primal." 5e makes fey nature spirits, so you could argue nature magic is just camouflaged arcane magic. I like a slightly different approach. All that arcane/psychic/divine magic is being introduced into the world, and it doesn't really go away, but gets partially absorbed into the system. It is still distinct enough to be pulled out as magic, but it is hooked up with nature enough that you can't tap it the same way as with arcane magic.

 

[gyor]

Also what characters say about what magic is in different settings can vary wildly, a FR Wizard would talk about the Weave, a Darksun Wizard would talk about life force (arcane), the elements (divine), and the mind (psionic), Dragonlance Wizard would take about moons and gods, a Ravnica Wizard would talk about Mana, Planescape Wizard depends on their philosophy,
Eberron/Greyhawk/Mystara/Ravenloft I'm not sure.

 

[Umbran]

The Physical Magics are far from ineffable, and eventually are quantified to the point of integration with technology, but they still require a conscious Will to act upon the system.

Then it isn't really magic anymore. It is just Engineering that requires a person.

Or, alternatively - it is still ineffable about how it works. The results are predictable, but the practitioner cannot actually tell you how to do the act of will. Like in all those works in which a mentor teaches someone how to do magic -"Close your eyes, clear your mind, concentrate, and WILL IT TO HAPPEN!" That's nonsense. The phrase "will it to happen" has no real meaning, which is why the first several times the student tries this, it generally fails. The student has to have a moment of internal enlightenment, a realization or illumination, in which they finally just get it, and can do it.

 

[Lanefan]

In the real world: magic is kind of a catch-all term for anything that can't be explained by observation and-or perception. This includes on a small scale inability of attendees at a magic-tricks show to perceive how the trick is done; and on a larger scale also includes the inability for science to (yet) perceive (by observation and measurement) how something "supernatural" exists or works or occurs.

In my game worlds: magic is a 5th universal physical force alongside gravity and [the other three that I constantly forget], and is generally a bit more chaotic than the other four. Some creatures - and all deities - need it in order to exist, and some can via various means access and manipulate it into producing desired effects. Deities can do this on a whim; mortals need to go through sometimes-cumbersome rituals called spells.

As a side note, this provides a perfect explanation for wild magic surges when spells are interrupted or enchanted items are broken: there's three parts to casting a spell - summon (or gather) the energy, shape it into what you want, and release it (or bind it in an item). A true Wild Mage just skips the middle step. An interrupted caster gets it skipped for them. Either way, or when an enchanted item breaks, magical energy is released in a way unintended. Sometimes it fizzles harmlessly, other times...well...

 

[Tony Vargas]

Then it isn't really magic anymore. It is just Engineering that requires a person.

Sure. Like psionics. Or a sufficiently advanced technology that you /do/ understand the workings of.
Or magic in D&D.

But, unlike the hypothetical sufficiently advanced technology, it'd still likely be supernatural.