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D&D 5E Point Buy system for weapon proficiency or something.

TrueBagelMan

Explorer
So I was thinking of a system like point buy where you could pick what weapons your proficient in. Like depending on your class you get different amounts of points for there weapon proficiencies. Like wizard got points so instead of getting proficiency in there list, they could gain proficiency with a martial weapon. I really don’t see any problems with this since you could have a rogue using a longbow or a Wizard using a Greataxe. An idea possibly worth thinking about.
Any Thoughts?
 

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Jediking

Explorer
You can use the racial weapon training traits as a default (eg. Dwarves; Elves) to find out the equivalent point cost (2 points from Standard 27 point buy).

So a character can use 25 point buy instead and start with whatever weapon proficiencies and it should shake out OK.
 

delphonso

Explorer
I think armor would be more worth the points. If we're talking 25 out of 27 point-buy, I'd let a barbarian have access to Heavy Armor.

I would let players lose a skill for weapon proficiencies. Potentially, I'd allow them to swap out background tool proficiencies for a weapon if it made sense (druids with a shortbow? Why not.)

My fear would be robbing the martial classes of something. Fighters and Paladins have access to everything, so what do they get out of this deal?
 

Horwath

Legend
For next campaign, I think I will rework all weapons to martial "power level" and have all characters proficient with all weapons.

Fighting styles, Extra attack, higher HD, investment in str/dex will be more than enough to make a difference between "martial" and "non-martial" classes.
 


Being proficient in weapons that you aren't currently using is not worth anything. If I only ever use longswords, then my proficiency in battleaxe and maul are not worth anything at all; their contributing value is zero, and if you price them out at anything more than that, then you're over-valuing them.

Mechanically, allowing a wizard to trade all of their simple weapon proficiencies out for proficiency in longbow is generally equivalent to giving everyone proficiency with all weapons, because everyone can buy the one weapon they care about. Not that it would break the game or anything, if everyone was proficient in all weapons.
 

Li Shenron

Legend
I would let players lose a skill for weapon proficiencies.

This was my first thought as well.

A separate full "point buy" system might be an interesting idea, it will lead to another optimization mini-game like the point-buy for ability scores or the skill points in 3e. Whether this is good or bad depends on your players' interests and whether they like fiddle bits: that's because weapons are not all equivalent, so at the very least you'd have to differentiate the value between simple and martial weapons (and if you investigate the weapons list further, it might still not satisfy you and you'll want to also give different points value to different weapons in the same group).

I am not even considering armors yet, because those are even more complex considering there is a hierarchy to satisfy: light before medium before heavy. So what are you going to do here? Would you allow to buy proficiency in a single heavy armor without having lesser armors proficiency? Would you require at least one, half or all the proficiencies in the lower tier? There are many possible rules here, each with pros and cons.

Still, in a hypothetical new game design it would be generally a viable system. On the other hand, I wouldn't like to apply such system on top of 5e, mainly because for 5e martial classes there is nothing to gain and everything to lose from a point-buy system, since those classes already have all weapons proficiencies.

Spellcasters can completely avoid weapons if they want, since they can choose attack cantrips. Low-HP/AC casters who prefer to use a weapon typically IMXP choose the light crossbow (or longbow if elves) because it's ranged. High-HP/AC casters are more often melee-oriented, as they also partially contribute to front lines. The majority of casters however will be more interested in optimizing their spells rather than weaponry.

Generally I kind of think that a point-buy system would be an overkill compared to its usefulness. A very optimization-oriented player would like the option between many lesser proficiencies and less better proficiencies, but most players would just choose ONE favourite weapon and stick with it forever. The drawback is having to give up magic items found in treasure that you can't use, but this depends a lot on what are the DM's decisions on magic items.

So besides the amusing theorycrafting, I don't see much practical benefit in a whole system for this... if an occasional player wants a different weapon, I'd rather look into swapping an existing proficiency for that. Indeed the PHB offers only a feat option for acquiring more weapon profs, which is quite expensive. Swapping a weapon prof for another is too generous (everyone would swap a simple weapon for a martial weapon), unless you restrict it to the same weapon group but then it will be useless. Giving up a skill for a martial weapon proficiency sounds still expensive but almost right to me.
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
You can use the racial weapon training traits as a default (eg. Dwarves; Elves) to find out the equivalent point cost (2 points from Standard 27 point buy).

So a character can use 25 point buy instead and start with whatever weapon proficiencies and it should shake out OK.
How’d you work that value out? Not disagreeing, just curios about your method, as a reliable way to convert race features to point buy could be a very useful tool, but I haven’t found most attempts at such things entirely satisfying.
 

My fear would be robbing the martial classes of something. Fighters and Paladins have access to everything, so what do they get out of this deal?
I'd give them more skill and tool proficiencies.
For next campaign, I think I will rework all weapons to martial "power level" and have all characters proficient with all weapons.

Fighting styles, Extra attack, higher HD, investment in str/dex will be more than enough to make a difference between "martial" and "non-martial" classes.
For weapon combat. However non-martial classes have advantages outside of weapon proficiencies, and it might be tricky to give the martial classes bonuses in those areas commensurate with the bonuses with weapons that you're granting the non-martials.
 

Horwath

Legend
I'd give them more skill and tool proficiencies.
For weapon combat. However non-martial classes have advantages outside of weapon proficiencies, and it might be tricky to give the martial classes bonuses in those areas commensurate with the bonuses with weapons that you're granting the non-martials.

might give martials extra class skill proficiency, but I don't know how giving a wizard greatsword proficiency is giving him a boost? Might just get him killed sooner as he will think that he is a competent melee warrior, hahaha!
 

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