D&D 5E Replacing Darkvision with other special senses

[AliasBot]

My first thought with the Underdark subspecies was to give them blindsight 60' rather than super-darkvision, playing on how real-life animals that live in isolated cave systems (or just purely underground in general) sometimes go beyond "underdeveloped eyesight" to being out-and-out blind. But I think that would mean that they could ignore their Sunlight Sensitivity by just...keeping their eyes closed? And as much as I personally don't care for Sunlight Sensitivity, it seems like a trait that's pretty important to the peoples that have it, and having an innate trait that counteracts that weakness with no effort required, especially in a way that's that silly, is probably a bad idea. So that might be a dead end.

Aarakocra should have some sort of enhanced vision - that could be the basic "advantage on Perception rolls relying on eyesight" Keen Sight that Eagles and Owls get, or it could be something more like the "can see a mile away in perfect detail" vision that Eagle Totem Barbs get, but they should definitely get something. That might end up stepping on what people want to do with Elves' sight a bit, but I feel like eagle vision is a reasonable justification for Aarakocra to play in that space, too.

Aasimar can innately cast Light, so they have no need for darkvision: why skulk around in the darkness when you can bathe the world in holy light?

(The real spicy vision mechanic for Aasimar would be to give them 5-10' or so of truesight - a bunch of Celestials have truesight, so a highly-restricted version of that effect feels right for a people with celestial blood. Would truesight break anything in the early-game badly enough to take it off the table as an option?)

 

[Guest 6801328]

Ranged weapons attacks have disadvantage beyond their close range. Elves could ignore that.

So...if you want to roll an archer, make it an elf?

Maybe throw in “elves never suffer disadvantage to Wisdom checks relying on sight due to distance” to cover cases where the DM would fiat such a penalty.

How about "Elves have advantage on ability checks relying on vision at distances beyond 120'". That way if there is disadvantage it gets cancelled, but otherwise they have advantage.

Again, it's not something that really comes up very often unless the DM is improvising, but maybe if the ability existed it would happen more often.

 

[Charlaquin]

So...if you want to roll an archer, make it an elf?

Eh, in my experience it’s very rare that engagements occur at such ranges where it’d really be relevant, except maybe with thrown weapons. But if it favors archers too much for your taste, fair enough.

How about "Elves have advantage on ability checks relying on vision at distances beyond 120'". That way if there is disadvantage it gets cancelled, but otherwise they have advantage.

Again, it's not something that really comes up very often unless the DM is improvising, but maybe if the ability existed it would happen more often.

That seems weird to me, because they’d be more likely to succeed at over 120 ft. than they would at shorter distances.

 

[Charlaquin]

My first thought with the Underdark subspecies was to give them blindsight 60' rather than super-darkvision, playing on how real-life animals that live in isolated cave systems (or just purely underground in general) sometimes go beyond "underdeveloped eyesight" to being out-and-out blind. But I think that would mean that they could ignore their Sunlight Sensitivity by just...keeping their eyes closed? And as much as I personally don't care for Sunlight Sensitivity, it seems like a trait that's pretty important to the peoples that have it, and having an innate trait that counteracts that weakness with no effort required, especially in a way that's that silly, is probably a bad idea. So that might be a dead end.

I floated the idea earlier that Duergar could be blind but have blindsight within the radius of their Tremorsense. I forgot to mention it specifically, but under that model they would be unable to “see” creatures and objects that they couldn’t perceive with their tremorsense. Maybe that could be a model to explore with the other Underdark variants - enhance their people’s usual enhanced sense to the point of blindsight, but blind without it.

Aarakocra should have some sort of enhanced vision - that could be the basic "advantage on Perception rolls relying on eyesight" Keen Sight that Eagles and Owls get, or it could be something more like the "can see a mile away in perfect detail" vision that Eagle Totem Barbs get, but they should definitely get something. That might end up stepping on what people want to do with Elves' sight a bit, but I feel like eagle vision is a reasonable justification for Aarakocra to play in that space, too.

Personally, I wouldn’t be inclined to add any more onto the Aarakocra package. Flight at 1st level is strong enough, IMO. Though I suppose eagle vision is more or less a ribbon, so that might be safe to put on them. It’d be a good option for elves too! Thanks for pointing it out, I had forgotten about it.

Aasimar can innately cast Light, so they have no need for darkvision: why skulk around in the darkness when you can bathe the world in holy light?

(The real spicy vision mechanic for Aasimar would be to give them 5-10' or so of truesight - a bunch of Celestials have truesight, so a highly-restricted version of that effect feels right for a people with celestial blood. Would truesight break anything in the early-game badly enough to take it off the table as an option?)

Ooh, that is an interesting idea. Always-on Truesight is pretty crazy powerful though, even at a very short range...

 

[RangerWickett]

Don't be afraid to dream a little bit bigger.

Dwarves. Tremorsense, sure. Also depth sense, grade sense, and other abilities to navigate caves. That's not that impressive, though. That's just the passive stuff. They can also tremorping: by striking the ground with a hammer as an action, they can sense the location of any creature within 250 feet. However, this negates their tremorsense and that of other dwarves within the radius for one minute; non-dwarves easily hear the sound too. Dwarves also inherently know the weight and composition of anything within range of their tremorsense, allowing them to immediately gauge how many coins are in a treasure chest, for instance, and can detect hidden weapons with ease. Mimics too.

Elves. They can see life force and magic. They constantly have detect magic active, with unlimited range. Living creatures are also visible at any distance, though tree bark and most plants are much fainter than animals. Also, this life energy is sort of reflective, so it's possible to see non-living things - rocks and undead - with concealment if they're close to living things. They can sometimes even detect a lingering light that reveals the path of a group passing through, and if they spend a moment concentrating they can sort of run their awareness up that pathway, like light through a fiber optic cable, to see what is going on. Indeed, if you ask Legolas what his elf eyes see, he can see over the horizon.

Gnomes. Gnomes exist both in the real world and in the fey realm, and they can send forth their mirrored selves like a faint and obvious illusion, and see through the senses of both versions of themselves. They can't wander too far, however, and things like force damage can harm their illusory self, which wounds the gnome. If the illusion is captured and forcibly separated for a long period of time, the gnome goes mad.

Halflings. They possess an empathic community chat channel, and innately absorb the publicly-discussed rumors and public lore of any place with a population of more than a dozen people. This lets them easily navigate crowded areas to avoid notice, even to evade bands of angry mobs or sufficiently large packs of wolves.

Stuff like that.

 

[Guest 6801328]

That seems weird to me, because they’d be more likely to succeed at over 120 ft. than they would at shorter distances.

I don't think so, mostly because there's no hard and fast rules setting DCs as a function of distance in this case.

"Can I make out what it is?"
"I'll need a perception roll. DC 15."
"How far away is it again?"
"About 90 feet."
"I'll back up another 30 feet so I get advantage."
"Ok, smartass, in that case, beyond 120 feet it's with disadvantage, so for YOU it's still a normal DC 15 roll."

But, yeah, it does carry weird implications. I guess it could be written to refer to any such check that is made "because of distance". Basically since there aren't rules for this, any language is going to have to kind of make its own rules.

 

[Guest 6801328]

Back on topic, I'd give Dwarven (or Gnomish?) tremorsense a decent radius, like 100' or more, but only if they use their action and don't move. It's kind of like listening to railroad tracks for approaching trains.

 

[Charlaquin]

Back on topic, I'd give Dwarven (or Gnomish?) tremorsense a decent radius, like 100' or more, but only if they use their action and don't move. It's kind of like listening to railroad tracks for approaching trains.

That’d also help solve the problem of Tremorsense making dwarves immune to
Stealth attacks that originate within their Tremorsense radius. I like that.

 

[Haldrik]

In one of the threads about racial ASIs, the suggestion of beefing up other race features to compensate for their removal came up, and one of the suggestions was giving dwarves tremorsense. And I absolutely loved the idea.

Now, I don’t want this to be another thread about racial ASIs, so forget that element of the suggestion. What I want to focus on is the concept of replacing some or all races’ darkvision with other forms of special senses. Here are some possibilities I have been considering:

Dwarves - 60 ft. Tremorsense
Elves - “Low-light vision” a-la the Skulker Feat (dim light doesn’t impose disadvantage on your Wisdom checks that rely on sight), or Keen Sight a-la some monster stat blocks (advantage on Wisdom checks relying on sight, which would cancel out with the disadvantage from dim light). The latter would replace the Perception proficiency as well as Darkvision.
Dragonborn - 30 ft. Blindsight, 60 ft. Darkvision (I know they don’t usually have darkvision to begin with, but I feel they could use a boost anyway, and this would put their sensory perception in line with that of dragons, but at half the range)
Gnomes - 60 ft. Tremorsense, or 30 ft. Tremorsense and “low-light vision”
Half-elves - “Low-light vision”
Half-Orcs - maybe 30 ft. Darkvision and Keen Smell (advantage on Wisdom checks relying on smell) to tie in with their classic porcine association?
Tieflings - 60 ft. Devil’s Sight, a-la the Warlock Invocation (normal vision in darkness within range, including magical darkness, but no change to perception in dim light)
Drow, Duergar, and Svirfneblin - 60 ft. Darkvision and Sunlight Sensitivity on top of the special senses for their base race

Any thoughts on introducing such a change? Alternative suggestions? Complaints about balance issues?

"Low light vision" is less valuable, and personally I ignore it in my campaigns. It would be a waste.

For the Elf, I would rather see the radiate an aura of light, even with optional flavor of spontaneously manifesting luminous tattoos if the player was into magical tattoos.

Relatedly, I feel the High Elf should get Mage Armor at will, that can appear as if any armor but traditionally appears as either silky Elven Chainmail or as a luminous aura of light.

For the Wood Elf, I like the Shakespeare flavor that they are strictly nocturnal, so I am ok with them having Darkvision.

 

[Haldrik]

Don't be afraid to dream a little bit bigger.

Dwarves. Tremorsense, sure. Also depth sense, grade sense, and other abilities to navigate caves. That's not that impressive, though. That's just the passive stuff. They can also tremorping: by striking the ground with a hammer as an action, they can sense the locaytion of any creature within 250 feet. However, this negates their tremorsense and that of other dwarves within the radius for one minute; non-dwarves easily hear the sound too. Dwarves also inherently know the weight and composition of anything within range of their tremorsense, allowing them to immediately gauge how many coins are in a treasure chest, for instance, and can detect hidden weapons with ease. Mimics too.

Elves. They can see life force and magic. They constantly have detect magic active, with unlimited range. Living creatures are also visible at any distance, though tree bark and most plants are much fainter than animals. Also, this life energy is sort of reflective, so it's possible to see non-living things - rocks and undead - with concealment if they're close to living things. They can sometimes even detect a lingering light that reveals the path of a group passing through, and if they spend a moment concentrating they can sort of run their awareness up that pathway, like light through a fiber optic cable, to see what is going on. Indeed, if you ask Legolas what his elf eyes see, he can see over the horizon.

Gnomes. Gnomes exist both in the real world and in the fey realm, and they can send forth their mirrored selves like a faint and obvious illusion, and see through the senses of both versions of themselves. They can't wander too far, however, and things like force damage can harm their illusory self, which wounds the gnome. If the illusion is captured and forcibly separated for a long period of time, the gnome goes mad.

Halflings. They possess an empathic community chat channel, and innately absorb the publicly-discussed rumors and public lore of any place with a population of more than a dozen people. This lets them easily navigate crowded areas to avoid notice, even to evade bands of angry mobs or sufficiently large packs of wolves.

Stuff like that.

Of course, Elf gets Detect Magic as a sense.

I would like more options to choose from.

So a player who wants Mage Armor can choose that. And a player who wants Detect Magic can do that.

I tend to associate Mage Armor more with High Elf and Detect Magic more with Eladrin. But it is fine to let the player choose. And add Misty Step to the list of choices.