D&D 5E 'Justice' in 5E

[akr71]

TL/DR; the party subdued the BBEG & freed a good NPC cleric. What would the cleric suggest doing with the BBEG?

The long version.
The party made a deal with a Night Hag -> info on the BBEG's whereabouts and in exchange they would leave her chained in a specific location for the Night Hag to trap soul in the hag's soul bag. The party doesn't seem to have any moral qualms about doing this, but they also aren't too concerned about reneging on their deal with the hag. They are powerful enough now that the hag doesn't pose much of a threat.

The BBEG is a priestess of Loviatar who was subverting the local Temple of Ilmater and the villagers to her cult. Along the way the party rescued an NPC cleric - a friend of the party who disappeared while investigating troubling portents the cleric received. Now freed, the cleric of Ilmater is suggesting that the BBEG be brought before the villagers and be held accountable for her actions - more to prove to the villagers what was up and how they were duped more than anything else.

What then? I think the villagers would demand blood - the BBEG was responsible for much suffering including the demise of their protector, a brave paladin of Ilmater. Would a cleric of Ilmater care if the BBEG's soul is captured by a night hag? Would the cleric be ok with the mob killing the BBEG? As a LG cleric of a LG deity, I'm leaning towards no. But what then? There's no jail, no town guard - its a village with a temple in the middle of farmland. The cleric could ask the party to escort the BBEG to the nearest city to stand trial, but that is waaay out of the party's way. They have interests there - and some influence - but I'm not sure how much they want to be delayed after the current diversion.

 

[Flamestrike]

Would a cleric of Ilmater care if the BBEG's soul is captured by a night hag?

Yes, they (a LG Cleric of Illmater) the most definitely would have problems with that.

Ilmater was the incarnation of compassion, and the eternal foe of suffering. He sought to offer aid and relief and words of comfort to those in pain, who were oppressed, or otherwise in great need...

Ilmater was the most forgiving of beings; it was thought he could even forgive Loviatar, Maiden of Pain, if she repented of her cruel deeds. Though he knew full well the atrocious and horrific acts that wicked creatures could do, he remained forever hopeful that evil beings could one day be turned to good, or destroyed, and so he stayed firm in his goals

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Ilmater

Night Hags basically destroy souls, and that's a cardinal sin.

Would the cleric be ok with the mob killing the BBEG? As a LG cleric of a LG deity, I'm leaning towards no.

No to mob justice.

A lawful execution maybe (and very reluctantly, and after seeking to persuade the authorities to show clemency via commutation to a life sentence with hard labour) with an offer to accept a conversion and repentance before-hand.

He would try and win the Priest of Lovitar over with mercy and compassion, and try and show them the pain wrought by their actions, and seek their repentance, and conversion to Illmater.

Thats one less soul for Lovitar, and one more soul for Illmater.

 

[Musing Mage]

This sounds to me like a great set-up for players to work through, you don't as DM need to have concrete answers already mapped out - this is the players' scenario to puzzle out and you need to adapt accordingly.

As DM simply adjudicate the consequences of what your players choose to do without infusing personal judgment. The NPCs will have their own motives and ideas and you can speak through them. There will be those who want immediate vengeance, those who want justice, those who might plot to help the BBEG... etc. Lots to mine here, don't worry about writing it out in advance, let the scenario develop organically.

 

[jgsugden]

There is no absolute right answer. I'd look for the answers to these questions that 1.) Are most consistent with the personality for the established NPCs, and 2.) Create the most interesting story.

Ilmater is about relief and support, and taking on the burdens of others. He is the eternal foe of suffering - and allowing anyone to have their soul taken by the Night Hag (to be delivered to Hades) would generally be against the faith, but I imagine an individual might not agree with all the tenets of their faith, especially if the Hag destroyed someone they cared about.

Make it a good story.

 

[tetrasodium]

TL/DR; the party subdued the BBEG & freed a good NPC cleric. What would the cleric suggest doing with the BBEG?

The long version.
The party made a deal with a Night Hag -> info on the BBEG's whereabouts and in exchange they would leave her chained in a specific location for the Night Hag to trap soul in the hag's soul bag. The party doesn't seem to have any moral qualms about doing this, but they also aren't too concerned about reneging on their deal with the hag. They are powerful enough now that the hag doesn't pose much of a threat.

The BBEG is a priestess of Loviatar who was subverting the local Temple of Ilmater and the villagers to her cult. Along the way the party rescued an NPC cleric - a friend of the party who disappeared while investigating troubling portents the cleric received. Now freed, the cleric of Ilmater is suggesting that the BBEG be brought before the villagers and be held accountable for her actions - more to prove to the villagers what was up and how they were duped more than anything else.

What then? I think the villagers would demand blood - the BBEG was responsible for much suffering including the demise of their protector, a brave paladin of Ilmater. Would a cleric of Ilmater care if the BBEG's soul is captured by a night hag? Would the cleric be ok with the mob killing the BBEG? As a LG cleric of a LG deity, I'm leaning towards no. But what then? There's no jail, no town guard - its a village with a temple in the middle of farmland. The cleric could ask the party to escort the BBEG to the nearest city to stand trial, but that is waaay out of the party's way. They have interests there - and some influence - but I'm not sure how much they want to be delayed after the current diversion.

There are quite a few great historical examples. For example...
Lingchi if you want blood & gore. Cangue with the cage that forces the person being punished to stand until death from gravity or without that pretty much results in death by thirst or starvation if there is no-one willing to care for the punished individual.

 

[Oofta]

In my world? LG doesn't mean always forgiving. If there are no prisons, no way to effectively punish the BBEG you only have a few options. Trial and execution is right up there on the list of options. That may not sit well with our modern sensibilities, but we have options they simply do not have.

This doesn't mean there can't be a trial of course and if there's anything like a magistrate they should preside. But if the identity and acts of the BBEG can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt? No way to guarantee a change of heart? Off with his head.

 

[MarkB]

The party made a deal with a Night Hag -> info on the BBEG's whereabouts and in exchange they would leave her chained in a specific location for the Night Hag to trap soul in the hag's soul bag. The party doesn't seem to have any moral qualms about doing this, but they also aren't too concerned about reneging on their deal with the hag. They are powerful enough now that the hag doesn't pose much of a threat.

That part, at least, seems foolish. The party may be high enough level that she can't effectively hurt them directly, but how many of their friends and family are immune to having their souls gradually sucked out over a few restless nights?

 

[Flamestrike]

In my world? LG doesn't mean always forgiving.

Forgiveness and compassion are central to his Gods Dogma, in addition to being both a law abiding (lawful) and merciful and kind (good) person.

If the law of the land was execution, and the Priest lacked the legal authority to override that, then so be it (but he would certainly advocate strongly for a commutation of the sentence, in order to allow the evil priest time to repent thus providing an extra soul for Illmater, and one less soul for Lovitar).

He certainly aint handing the Priest over to a Night Hag to have his soul annhilated.

 

[Flamestrike]

That part, at least, seems foolish. The party may be high enough level that she can't effectively hurt them directly, but how many of their friends and family are immune to having their souls gradually sucked out over a few restless nights?

Yeah, that party seems pretty evilish to me. Definitely not good.

 

[Oofta]

Forgiveness and compassion are central to his Gods Dogma, in addition to being both a law abiding (lawful) and merciful and kind (good) person.

If the law of the land was execution, and the Priest lacked the legal authority to override that, then so be it (but he would certainly advocate strongly for a commutation of the sentence, in order to allow the evil priest time to repent thus providing an extra soul for Illmater, and one less soul for Lovitar).

He certainly aint handing the Priest over to a Night Hag to have his soul annhilated.

I agree on the night hag front, forgot to mention that.

I also agree that he would likely try to get the BBEG to see the error of their ways. But if that's not happening? Or if there's no way to tell if the BBEG has truly had a change of heart, or will not just go back to their evil ways as soon as released? The only way to stop him from killing more innocents and shedding more blood will likely be execution.

Assuming of course that there's no option to realistic option to imprison or reform the BBEG. Or at least that's how I would run it. Give BBEG one last chance to truly repent, cast zone of truth to see if it's true, strip them of everything and ship them off to some monastery where they can be closely watched. If that doesn't work it's to the gallows. If you let him go, you are accepting at least in part responsibility for the BBEG's actions.