D&D 5E Possible Changes to Rebalance the Ability Scores

[Don Durito]

It's passive to the action but you are Actively invoking your Endurance.

Athletics (Con) is the better way to do it but the default rules ties skills and abilities.


Actually that's an issue I have with 5e.
You are talking about Medieval to Rennaissance level tech. Travelling the world to adventure would involve a TON of Endurance checks due to weather, climate, resting spots. long marchs, and poor sleep.

The default rules do tie ability rolls to skills, but then they also don't include Endurance, so if we're changing things...

To me the test of whether something should be a skill is "is there anyway to directly leverage this to accomplish your goals" as I suggested above in the city example. I played through enough 4e skill challenges where Endurance was my best skill to know how difficult it is.

Ideally you would divorce the ability scores from skills formally (the 5e system is designed to make this easy it's just that playtesters balked at removing formal skills).

Make endurance part of Mountaineering and include climbing things, and skiing and navigating, or merge it with survival or something. (Who has Survival? The Ranger and Barbarian, who should be good at enduring outdoor conditions? The Ranger and Barbarian).

 

[Minigiant]

The default rules do tie ability rolls to skills, but then they also don't include Endurance, so if we're changing things...

To me the test of whether something should be a skill is "is there anyway to directly leverage this to accomplish your goals" as I suggested above in the city example. I played through enough 4e skill challenges where Endurance was my best skill to know how difficult it is.

Ideally you would divorce the ability scores from skills formally (the 5e system is designed to make this easy it's just that playtesters balked at removing formal skills).

Make endurance part of Mountaineering and include climbing things, and skiing and navigating, or merge it with survival or something. (Who has Survival? The Ranger and Barbarian, who should be good at enduring outdoor conditions? The Ranger and Barbarian).

I agree. Endurance is one of those skills that get heavy use or no use.

The best way to do it is to untie skill and ability score. But from experience, new players can't handle constantly making combinations.

"Wait. What do I add again?"

Endurance as a skill is better for new players. You add the 2 modifiers together once and stick it to the paper.

 

[Levistus's_Leviathan]

The question is do these really happen often enough to justify having a skill?

In my campaigns they do. Also, if a skill is added to the game, that will make it be used more that if it weren't a skill. Some skills are typically used more than others (Perception/Stealth more than Animal Handling/Religion), but not having a skill automatically means that it won't be used that often.

I say this as an endurance athlete who really likes playing characters who are good at endurance and did so quite often in 4e and still for all that found it very hard to actively make use of the skill. If I want to get into a town I might use Persausian to bribe the guards, or Deception to lie to them, Athletics to climb the wall or Stealth to sneak in. I might even use History to remember that the ancient builders built extensive underground aqueducts. How do I use Endurance to get into the town?

First do Athletics to lift up the portcullis in that acts as the city-gate, and then roll Endurance to see how long you can hold it up. Or, if you have to squeeze your way through a small sewer to get into the town, roll Endurance to see if you can force yourself through the small passage-way. I could come up with other examples, too.

And the difference is tenuous anyway. Do I roll Endurance or a Con save to deal with freezing cold weather?

Con save. Saves aren't voluntary, checks almost always are.

 

[Don Durito]

In my campaigns they do. Also, if a skill is added to the game, that will make it be used more that if it weren't a skill. Some skills are typically used more than others (Perception/Stealth more than Animal Handling/Religion), but not having a skill automatically means that it won't be used that often.

Only if you can use it actively. Endurance was always a skill that was mostly called for by the GM. It is difficult, as I said, to use it to actively address problems.

First do Athletics to lift up the portcullis in that acts as the city-gate, and then roll Endurance to see how long you can hold it up. Or, if you have to squeeze your way through a small sewer to get into the town, roll Endurance to see if you can force yourself through the small passage-way. I could come up with other examples, too.

So if Endurance is in the game I now need to spend two proficiences to do what I could have previously done with one? No thanks.

Con save. Saves aren't voluntary, checks almost always are.

Questionable. Especially with knowledge skills, and definitely not the case with Endurance.

 

[le Redoutable]

hello
perhaps you could take a look at my topic " Replacing CON with Energy "

D&D 6E - replacing Constitution with Energy

 

[Krachek]

Simple house rule,
when your bonus is not optimal, use your proficiency modifier instead!