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D&D (2024) Is the 5E player base going to split?

aco175

Legend
I do not see a big deal with the changed as of now. The fear of the unknown and internet rumors drive us to panic. I think most will depend on how much the initial books will cost. If they print a lot and the cost is in the 30$ish, then fine, but if they want 60$ish after any discount, then we will see people upset. If they want to try and force you to DDBeyond and go digital, same problem.
 

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Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
Some people might be like "I don't like these changes, so I'm gonna still use the 5e rules instead of the 5.5e rules for this stuff. But the rest is cool" and people will throw a tempest in a teacup over it...

I agree. What we have seen so far is that the changes largely lie in the space of character generation, rather than to anything notable in the resolution mechanics, and without drastically altering the power level of PCs.

That means that, even if you don't like those changes, and don't buy the new core rulebooks, you'll find precious little in the way of continuing to buy adventures or other supporting materials. That's what I think real compatibility is, honestly.
 

Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
I do not see a big deal with the changed as of now. The fear of the unknown and internet rumors drive us to panic. I think most will depend on how much the initial books will cost. If they print a lot and the cost is in the 30$ish, then fine, but if they want 60$ish after any discount, then we will see people upset. If they want to try and force you to DDBeyond and go digital, same problem.
They are going to use this opportunity to increase the MSRP; they've been putting it off for years. The price-gouging format of the upcoming Spelljammer material is evidence of this. I expect $60-$65 per book.
 

DEFCON 1

Legend
Supporter
I still think the real question is who's going to re-buy their core books.
I will. I have no problem with that. The way I see it... I spent what... $120 or so eight years ago back in 2014 for a trio of books? I got WAY MORE than enough use out of all three of them these past 8 years to get my money's worth dozens of times over. To think that I'd have any sort of issue spending another $180(?) or so two years from now for another 8 years of frequent use is kind of ridiculous in my opinion.

Heck, if we're talking 24 months to get $180 for a new set of core books... that's just $7.50 a month if I start saving right now. Cut back on one trip to McDonalds a month or a pair of Starbucks coffees and I will have the cash to buy the three core books when they get released no problem.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
My only concern is WotC publishing a backwards compatible revised PHB, but some DMs requiring the new books despite the old books still being compatible. That attitude would need to be shamed mercilessly.
I'm sure a few jerks will do that, but in my experience it's more likely that DMs will be cool about it. It tends to be the players pushing the use of the newest and coolest books, especially if there's kewl new powers to abuse.
I still think the real question is who's going to re-buy their core books.
Who knows. The character creation changes we basically know about. Floating ASI, race changes as per post-Tasha's, etc. But we also know that the monster stat blocks and mechanics are changing slightly, so the MM will likely be different. Hopefully updated so the monsters are more than boring bags of hit points with maybe a multiattack. The real question is the DMG. It's been slagged from day one. So many people don't bother reading it that it's a meme. Return of the Lazy DM is a better DMG. The 4E DMGs are better DMGs. I don't see them simply reprinting the book. I expect the biggest changes will be there. Or, more accurately, I hope the biggest changes are there.
 

aco175

Legend
They are going to use this opportunity to increase the MSRP; they've been putting it off for years. The price-gouging format of the upcoming Spelljammer material is evidence of this. I expect $60-$65 per book.
Would the Amazon cost be more 30-35 though? I certainly see some sort of increase, but I recall the 3e model was that they printed so many books that the cost was less initially.
 

Mercurius

Legend
There is this strange notion that D&D players are a monolithic group, that (almost) everyone plays one version of the game, one set of rules, with little variation.

Now maybe this is more true today than it was in decades past. Maybe the current boom of "Stranger Babies" (post-Stranger Things) tend more towards playing the RAW, and sticking to whatever WotC publishes - I have no idea.

But part of the problem, and perception around "splitting the fan base," is the idea that either we all cohere around the same set of rules and book, or we're "splintered." Or that it isn't natural for us to splinter off and diverge - or customize the game to our liking.

Meaning, I'm questioning this notion that the player base is or should be moving lock-step from one edition to the other. Rather, what if D&D is more like a tree, that branches endlessly, and each "blossom" at the end of a twig is a single game group?

There will still be, by default, a central limb or branch from which most campaigns blossom. But even within that, there is great (endless) diversity.

I think back to an aspect of WotC's marketing before 5E came out. They said that everyone was invited, that D&D was more than just one edition or set of rules. They even made impossible promises that they couldn't keep: that everything would be compatible with 5E, everything supported. To give them some credit, this isn't entirely false; they opened up the past library for download, they created DM's Guild, etc. And of course there's only so much that they can do; providing rules conversions for every edition of D&D for every product is simply not worth spending their resources on.

But I think the spirit of "we're all D&D players, everyone's invited - if you want to use this, hopefully you can, but if not and want to stick with your hybrid TSR game, that's fine too" is a good one.

In fact, if I were to WotC, I would double-down--again and again--on this tenet: "Make the game your own. We'll provide the core rules, and keep adapting them to what we feel like represents the current player base as much as possible, providing new settings and adventures that explore the possibilities of the game, but we're not excluding anyone, and even if you play an older version of the game, or a hybrid of some kind, hopefully you can use what we publish in your game in some form or fashion."

In other words, not only normalize hybridization, but advocate for it. The core rules are just something to improvise off of, to whatever degree you like. In fact, what is "core" is your game.

But it is also on the fan base to respond in kind. There are always going to be people who are disappointed with the current state of the game, whether because they preferred the version in (what they imagine was) the D&D of 24.271 years ago (or whatever), or because WotC is going in a direction that is further and further from what feels like 'D&D to me." Some of this might be warranted, as change is not inherently good (or bad) - but to some degree this implies a certain degree of stubborn entitlement, as if it is WotC's responsible to cater to my preferences, whatever they are.

This is, of course, impossible - not simply because they can't please everyone all of the time, but that--by economic necessity--they have to remain focused on their actual, current demographic.

Things change. The game moves on, and the base is different now. By my estimations, more than half of WotC's estimated 55-60 million people who have ever played D&D, started up since 5E began. That's 30 million or so players who are Zennials or cuspy Millenials (say, born c. 1995 or later). And of the remaining 25-30 million who started earlier, probably only 5 million or so still actively play or purchase products.

(The exact numbers aren't important, but the main point is: there are many times as many newer players than there are carryovers from earlier editions).

So maybe "splintering" isn't such a bad thing? At least if we embody that spirit of "everyone's invited," which means that all versions of D&D are valid and fine, because they're all part of the same tree that is the ever-growing tradition of D&D. Meaning, maybe the negative elements of splintering--the in-fighting, the "if you don't like this, then you're x," or "if you like that, then you're y"--could be jettisoned, but that's at least somewhat--if not mostly--on us. It is WotC's job to set the tone, to provide the context of the game as it is today, but that still means that a lot is up to us.
 


overgeeked

B/X Known World
They are going to use this opportunity to increase the MSRP; they've been putting it off for years. The price-gouging format of the upcoming Spelljammer material is evidence of this. I expect $60-$65 per book.
It's a luxury product for a niche of a niche hobby. Price gouging is jacking up the cost of food, medicine, housing, and fuel...especially during an emergency. They're not in the same universe as a game book that you think it too expensive. I get that this is the internet and hyperbole is second nature to some...but really, settle down.
 

Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
Would the Amazon cost be more 30-35 though? I certainly see some sort of increase, but I recall the 3e model was that they printed so many books that the cost was less initially.
If you normally buy through Amazon, then the price still goes up for you.
 

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