D&D 5E Are Per Rest Resources a Hindrance?

[James Gasik]

How about parries? You get x uses of an ability that allows you to parry a weapon attack that hits you, making it an automatic miss?

 

[Oofta]

if i WANT a non magic character with options like a wizard (or even a warlock) and power in line with those casters you would tell me "that isn't a class" even though we HAD those options in the last 2 editions...

what makes them stand out is the ability to change the flow of the story the same way a caster can but without magic

I'm not going to discuss previous editions. All I can say is that the big game changing things in my campaign are not based on spells, they're based on PC decisions.

If the group needs to get halfway around the world, it doesn't matter to me if a fellow PC casts teleport, we pay some NPC to make it happen, or we have to take a trip on a boat. If the DM has decided that it needs to happen, they will provide some way to make it happen.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

How about parries? You get x uses of an ability that allows you to parry a weapon attack that hits you, making it an automatic miss?

I recently preflavored the monks deflect/catch missiles to work on anything that is an attack roll (melee or ranged) and so far I like it

 

[James Gasik]

The difference is, if the PC's have abilities like this, they can be proactive about their use and decide which direction the narrative goes.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I'm not going to discuss previous editions. All I can say is that the big game changing things in my campaign are not based on spells, they're based on PC decisions.

just drop it then. I don't want to go round and round... you don't like it got it.

If the group needs to get halfway around the world, it doesn't matter to me if a fellow PC casts teleport, we pay some NPC to make it happen, or we have to take a trip on a boat. If the DM has decided that it needs to happen, they will provide some way to make it happen.

and if I say "My monk is based on superboy prime, so I punch reality and a hole appears so we walk to the other side of the world" thats cool too... I just want a class that has more fantastic abilities for martial characters

 

[Shardstone]

I will never understand how the fighter having four base superiority dice per short/long rest is too complicated. I've played with people who can't grasp the concept of Proficiency Bonus after 6+ sessions who still at least grasp onto the idea of a dice pool you can roll sometimes.

It really feels like the people who argue for simplicity think that anything, absolutely anything that requires any amount of effort is too complex.

 

[Minigiant]

I don't think there's a perfect solution. I'm playing a monk in a game with a druid, a short rest later and we're good to go. Meanwhile the rogue was ready to push on long ago while the sorcerer and paladin want to take a long rest.

If it were up to me we'd might either have 1 type of rest or figure out a way to have partial recovery of resources based on how long you rest. Have options and advice about how to adjust pacing so for 1 group resource recovery starts after a 15 minute rest while for others it's an overnight rest.

I do that in my campaign now to a certain degree with the gritty rest rules that I use, I think it would require a lot of playtesting to come up with a better solution. If there even is one.

Again I think the core issue is that 5e more or less designed around having 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests between long rests.


So the game falls apart if the DM doesn't metagame out 5-9 encounters and 1-3 short rests and the players don't manage resources under the same expecattion. Ultimately the fighter only has 3* Action Surges and Second Winds a day but only 1 of each at any time. And any resources gained by subclasses tend to be of lower power and few in number as well. Rogue is worse as the class has ZERO additional resources beyond HP and HO and relies on long term sections or DM gifted situations to get spotlight

Again there are many solutions. 4e tried putting everyone on the same schedule. Late 3.5 offered TOM and TOB classe.

There are many options. The first step is the community admitting thay other have an issue and allow WOTC to give solutions.

* Until level 17

 

[Vaalingrade]

I will never understand how the fighter having four base superiority dice per short/long rest is too complicated. I've played with people who can't grasp the concept of Proficiency Bonus after 6+ sessions who still at least grasp onto the idea of a dice pool you can roll sometimes.

It really feels like the people who argue for simplicity think that anything, absolutely anything that requires any amount of effort is too complex.

They won the argument that 'adding 2' was too hard for people, so they're emboldened.

 

[payn]

Again I think the core issue is that 5e more or less designed around having 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests between long rests.


So the game falls apart if the DM doesn't metagame out 5-9 encounters and 1-3 short rests and the players don't manage resources under the same expecattion. Ultimately the fighter only has 3* Action Surges and Second Winds a day but only 1 of each at any time. And any resources gained by subclasses tend to be of lower power and few in number as well. Rogue is worse as the class has ZERO additional resources beyond HP and HO and relies on long term sections or DM gifted situations to get spotlight

Again there are many solutions. 4e tried putting everyone on the same schedule. Late 3.5 offered TOM and TOB classe.

There are many options. The first step is the community admitting thay other have an issue and allow WOTC to give solutions.

* Until level 17

What if the community doesn't have an issue? Is it possible this is just a problem for hardcore gamers?

 

[Shardstone]

Again I think the core issue is that 5e more or less designed around having 6-8 encounters and 2 short rests between long rests.


So the game falls apart if the DM doesn't metagame out 5-9 encounters and 1-3 short rests and the players don't manage resources under the same expecattion. Ultimately the fighter only has 3* Action Surges and Second Winds a day but only 1 of each at any time. And any resources gained by subclasses tend to be of lower power and few in number as well. Rogue is worse as the class has ZERO additional resources beyond HP and HO and relies on long term sections or DM gifted situations to get spotlight

Again there are many solutions. 4e tried putting everyone on the same schedule. Late 3.5 offered TOM and TOB classe.

There are many options. The first step is the community admitting thay other have an issue and allow WOTC to give solutions.

* Until level 17

Falls apart is too strong I think, and this hyperbolic perspective is holding back what me and you both largely agree on.

The game doesn't fall apart. I play 1-3 encounters, maybe a short rest, and a long rest before or after usually. The game feels good there; there's only 9 or so rounds of combat, and magic items have given my more basic players a lot of fun things to do that normally they could not.

I guess you can say that me using magic items is helping, but needless to say, "falls apart" is never how I feel. And for most campaigns that these days last about 6 months, there isn't much time IMO to go more than 10+ levels and really experience any of the chaffing, even if you were to start in Tier 3.