Spelljammer Dark Sun confirmed? Or, the mysterious case of the dissappearing Spelljammer article...

[doctorbadwolf]

That's untrue. It is a category of magic given very little mechanical weight, not none. Arcane foci mechanically interact with only arcane power. Not with wizard spells. Not with warlock spells. Not with sorcerer spells. Arcane power. That's why a wizard can give his focus to a warlock and the warlock can use it, too. Because the focus doesn't care about class lists or classes. It only cares about arcane power.

This is false. A warlock and wizard can use the same focus because their classes both allow them to do so.

 

[Maxperson]

This is false. A warlock and wizard can use the same focus because their classes both allow them to do so.

RAW explicitly says otherwise. I will quote it again.

Chapter 5, Page 151 of the PHB...

"An arcane focus is a special item-an orb, a crystal, a rod, a specially constructed staff, a wand-like length of wood, or some similar item designed to channel the power of arcane spells."

What is it designed to do? Not cast warlock lists. Not cast wizard lists. Not cast sorcerer lists. It is designed to channel arcane spells. Period. That's the RAW of the item.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Arcane foci mechanically interact with only arcane power. Not with wizard spells.

Nope.

Spellcasting Focus​

You can use an arcane focus (see the Adventuring Gear section) as a spellcasting focus for your wizard spells.

The rules specifically refer to "Wizard spells", not "arcane spells". RAW, a multiclass wizard/bard could not use a wand to cast bard spells.

Interestingly, the rules for artificers say this:

Tools Required​

You produce your artificer spell effects through your tools. You must have a spellcasting focus—specifically thieves’ tools or some kind of artisan’s tool—in hand when you cast any spell with this Spellcasting feature (meaning the spell has an ‘M’ component when you cast it). You must be proficient with the tool to use it in this way. See chapter 5, “Equipment,” in the Player’s Handbook for descriptions of these tools.

Note that it does not specify "artificer spells". A multiclass artificer/cleric could use their tools to cast cleric spells (a single class cleric can also do that with the Artificer Initiate Feat).

 

[Maxperson]

Nope.

The rules specifically refer to "Wizard spells", not "arcane spells". RAW, a multiclass wizard/bard could not use a wand to cast bard spells.

Of course it can be used for wizard spells because of the rules on page 151 which allow it to channel arcane power. The wizard uses it for wizard spells. The focus channels arcane power, not specifically wizard spells. This is RAW.

The bard is a case of specific beats general and uses his instrument as his arcane focus.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

The bard is a case of specific beats general and uses his instrument as his arcane focus.

Nope.

Spellcasting Focus​

You can use a musical instrument (see the Tools section) as a spellcasting focus for your bard spells.

It says "spellcasting focus". It does not specify that the instrument is an arcane focus, and I don't think 5e rules ever mention if bards (or artificers) are arcane or divine casters.

Conclusion: an arcane focus is a thing. It means "a focus that can be used by a wizard or sorcerer". It has no further meaning than that. Arcane magic is a term used by characters in world to describe certain types of magic, but it has no effect on rules.

 

[Maxperson]

Nope.

It says "spellcasting focus". It does not specify that the instrument is an arcane focus, and I don't think 5e rules ever mention if bards are arcane or divine casters.

They do.

Page 205 of the PHB

"All magic depends on the Weave, though different kinds of magic access it in a variety of ways. The spells of wizards, warlocks, sorcerers, and bards are commonly called arcane magic."

That makes their instrument an arcane focus specific to them, regardless of what the class wording is.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

commonly called

Is not the same as "is". This, like the Weave, is in world fluff, not rules.

 

[Maxperson]

I'm getting of tired of arguing here. If any of you can actually refute the RAW on page 151 of the PHB which explicitly says that arcane foci channel arcane spells(not lists or classes), I'll concede. If you can't refute it(and continuing to point at classes is not refutation) then I am correct here. I'll check back in the morning to see if anyone has an actual refutation of the rules.

Have a great night everyone!!

 

[Maxperson]

Is not the same as "is". This, like the Weave, is in world fluff, not rules.

The weave is mechanical, not fluff. Only the name is specific in world fluff. It has other names and forms on other worlds, but exists mechanically. Without it, your spells don't work.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

If any of you can actually refute the RAW on page 151 of the PHB which explicitly says that arcane foci channel arcane spells(not lists or classes)

Sure I can: BARDS CAN'T USE IT.

(Even multiclass Wizard/Bards can't use it to cast bard spells.)

If, as you claim, it's function is to channel "arcane magic", and if, as you claim, bard spells are arcane magic, then the only logical conclusion is an arcane focus can be used to cast bard spells.

I'm getting of tired of arguing here.

Sure, because you have as many legs to stand on as a zero legged donkey.