D&D (2024) Dungeons and Dragons future? Ray Winninger gives a nod to Mike Shea's proposed changes.

[CapnZapp]

Curious, why do you think it is intended to be used all the time. Sneak Attack, IIRC, has always been situational.

FWIW The Rogue class needs to get both its Sneak Attacks in nearly every round to be competitive DPR-wise.

But IMO the Rogue shouldn't need to compete on damage. This is only because SA is too weak to actually accomplish the class' signature ability: to backstab someone dead instantly.

I would much rather have a Rogue capable of reliably instakill more than one level-appropriate foe without triggering any alarm.

Sneak damage is too weak for this, and so, it gets used in "regular" combat.

 

[overgeeked]

I do think there is a difference between “not challenged” and “set up to win”

Maybe not a big enough one.

I'd say that's true. Not nearly a big enough difference.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

FWIW The Rogue class needs to get both its Sneak Attacks in nearly every round to be competitive DPR-wise.

This isn’t true. I’ve done the math, and the rogue’s SA with 1 attack per round is equal to the value obtained by extrapolating a wizard’s spell slots translated directly into single target damage over enough rounds to run the wizard out of slots. If they wizard uses slots for other things at all, the rogue does more damage over the same number of rounds.

Reaction attacks are extra.

 

[Parmandur]

So, they aren't paid to perform while playing the game?

Doesn't seem relevant, theybare playing a normal game in the way I've always experienced it...? The buse miniatures more often.

 

[Jer]

Actually, most people not using Feats and multiclassing is data based, not anecdotal. Beyond shared the numbers some time ago.

Keep in mind that the free version of DDB doesn't allow you to pick feats - you have to own the PHB digitally to get access to feats. So those numbers would be more interesting if they also include a breakdown by people who have actually purchased the content and also what proportion of games are using just the free rules vs. paid rules.

I actually do believe that it's probably true that most games don't use feats. But the D&D Beyond numbers can only show us so much to "prove" that.

 

[Parmandur]

Could you scare up a link?

Sure, though the site is a little sketchy:

D&D 5E - D&D Beyond Revisits Popular Feats

The folks over at D&D Beyond have revisited the stats in the most popular feats used by class on the DDB platform. It looks like the percentage of characters using feats has increased slightly. Here are the most popular feats in 2018 and now. And here are the top feats for each class...

www.enworld.org

 

[Parmandur]

Keep in mind that the free version of DDB doesn't allow you to pick feats - you have to own the PHB digitally to get access to feats. So those numbers would be more interesting if they also include a breakdown by people who have actually purchased the content and also what proportion of games are using just the free rules vs. paid rules.

I actually do believe that it's probably true that most games don't use feats. But the D&D Beyond numbers can only show us so much to "prove" that.

The Beyond statistics exclude people using the free version, and only included actively used characters, not tests. Still over two thirds of active PCs don't use Feats.

And before Beyond, Crawford reported that their Survey data showed that two thirds of people don't use Feats inn5E. Which matches my personal experience.

 

[Jer]

Then why make changes at all? Especially ones like the rewrites on races and monsters that are guaranteed to not make everyone happy.

Like I said earlier - 50th Anniversary is here and they're going to put out something for that. So it's a good place to consolidate the changes that have accrued over the last decade, including new ways of explaining existing rules (which includes the monster stat block revisions) and updates that they feel need to be made to stay relevant with the current player base (like the changes to races). Without the 50th anniversary providing an opportunity that they really can't pass up, I strongly suspect they wouldn't be talking about a new edition at all.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Like I said earlier - 50th Anniversary is here and they're going to put out something for that. So it's a good place to consolidate the changes that have accrued over the last decade, including new ways of explaining existing rules (which includes the monster stat block revisions) and updates that they feel need to be made to stay relevant with the current player base (like the changes to races). Without the 50th anniversary providing an opportunity that they really can't pass up, I strongly suspect they wouldn't be talking about a new edition at all.

Ok, that reads as "cash grab" to me. Thank you, I get it now.

 

[overgeeked]

Actually, most people not using Feats and multiclassing is data based, not anecdotal. Beyond shared the numbers some time ago.

Sure, though the site is a little sketchy:

D&D 5E - D&D Beyond Revisits Popular Feats

The folks over at D&D Beyond have revisited the stats in the most popular feats used by class on the DDB platform. It looks like the percentage of characters using feats has increased slightly. Here are the most popular feats in 2018 and now. And here are the top feats for each class...

www.enworld.org

So...how exactly did you get "most people don't use feats" from that data? Because that data shows the opposite. All with the caveat that not all 5E players use D&D Beyond, of course.

Level 1-3. Only variant humans can even have feats in this level range.

Level 4-7. If feats are used, everyone gets one feat by now...and most players pick an ASI to get their ability bonuses up. But 34% of all characters have feats by this level range.

Level 8+. You have between 51-60% of all characters with feats. That's the opposite of "most players don't use feats." That's quite literally the data showing that most players actually do use feats.