D&D (2024) What does Backward compatibility mean to you?

[Blue]

One thing I think we all need to remember here... before the books finally get released in 2024 and whole swathes of people start screaming "THEY SAID IT WAS GOING TO BE BACKWARDS COMPATIBLE! BUT IT ISN'T! THEY LIED TO US"...

Look, if I go and buy new books this year and next assuming they will be compatible because they say "It's 'Just D&D', it's the same edition" and then find out that some of the mechanics are no longer applicable, and others need to be reworked, then yes I will be vocal to say that they lied - and correct to do so. Because they made a statement and it turned out that they were saying something untrue that decreased the value to me of what I purchased from them.

This isn't something about sayig the 2014 is balanced or complete or anything like this. It's a statement of direction so we can properly gauge the value to us of the books coming out between now and then. They are saying it's "Just D&D" and they will keep the full value. It's understandable, when 5e was anounced 4e sales dried up. But if it ends up being a case of corporate greediness, and mechanics fromt hese books need to be reworked or just don't fit - then people have a right to yell.

 

[TwoSix]

And for the record, I don't believe them with the adventure claim, either. Not because I think that they are lying, but I think they are mistaken. The modifications we already see will necessitate monster changes, which means having my having to modify the pre 2024 adventures to take those changes into account. If they don't make these changes, then the increased power level for the PCs(all get bonus feats and better racial abilities) and loss of power for the monsters(no crits) will mean that I have to modify the number and/or power level of the monsters in those adventures. No matter which way they go, I will have to work to change those adventures, removing backwards compatibility.

I think that's a bit of a stretch. The delta of capability between a party having 5 PCs compared to 4 is a lot greater than any of the proposed changes so far, and I don't think anyone is advocating that you have to redo the entire adventure depending on if that 5th person shows up.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I really wish people would come with a different word for these kinds of changes than "errata". Errata implies the correction of a mistake; I mean, its derived from the same root word as "error". What is called errata in RPGs is, in large part, not correcting errors in the text, but actually changing things.

Sure, sure. But they use the same system of errata to make rules "corrections" when it's changes that bring certain elements in line with other elements of the game, even if there was nothing technically "wrong" with the old version. What becomes "wrong" is that it is out-of-date or no-longer-jives.

 

[Parmandur]

Just adventures though, it seems. Show me backwards compatibility with a rules supplement if you want me to buy backwards compatibility.

So far, they have provided backwards compatibility for all Race options in a simple sidebar. We'll see what they come up with for Classes, but no doubt there will be something.

 

[Parmandur]

I doubt 5.5 or 6 or what ever will be... but here is what I would say:

If I walk to a table and can have my character be made using the 2024+ rules, the player next to me be made using the 2014 (without adding or subtracting) phb and a 3rd player has a mix of those...

basically it has to play like essentials and PHB1 and PHB2 from 4e did together.

Seems doable based off of what we have so far. Indeed, with the releases aixe Tasha's we have had that in fact for years.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

When 5e was announced 4e sales dried up.

That's true of announcements.

But there's a weird phenomenon that I have experienced as a Game Store owner what is it... FOUR times now?:

Every time a new edition comes out, the old one suddenly moves again. Not in nearly the numbers it did when IT was the new edition, but in numbers far greater than its own recent sales. It happened when 2e switched to 3e (all the sudden our 2e stock moved after languishing for a few years). It happened when 3.0 switched to 3.5, and when 3.5 switched to 4e (the 3.5 PHB even suddenly went for big money on the aftermarket!) AND YES, even 4e had a big resurgence when 5e came out. I quickly blew through all my store copies, AND all my player's copies (my group of 8 players all had their own books, and they all "gave" them back to me to sell).

It's a weird thing, that until now I've tended to forget would happen, because I don't personally understand it. But then, I've always adopted whatever the NEW HAWT version of the game is, for better or worse. (It makes sense, of course, to play and promote the edition that currently has books in print!)

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Seems doable based off of what we have so far. Indeed, with the releases aixe Tasha's we have had that in fact for years.

if nothing changes from current rules and playtest (again they will be making more changes I'm sure) that isn't true. we already have lucky feat being diffrent, you can't play a character with lucky from the 2014 PHB and one with the lucky form the playtest togather.

 

[Parmandur]

if nothing changes from current rules and playtest (again they will be making more changes I'm sure) that isn't true. we already have lucky feat being diffrent, you can't play a character with lucky from the 2014 PHB and one with the lucky form the playtest togather.

They can just turn off the Feat variant from the 2014 book while allowing the core options. Feats are not a standard part of the rules.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

I think that's a bit of a stretch. The delta of capability between a party having 5 PCs compared to 4 is a lot greater than any of the proposed changes so far, and I don't think anyone is advocating that you have to redo the entire adventure depending on if that 5th person shows up.

It's interesting that for some people, the entirety of the Adventure can be perfectly playable under the "new" rules, but if a race, subclass, background, or monster in the short chapter in the back of the book does not line-up, then that book is NOT COMPATIBLE and is essentially garbage now!

(Or at least, that's what it often appears like they are suggesting).

 

[Parmandur]

That's true of announcements.

But there's a weird phenomenon that I have experienced as a Game Store owner what is it... FOUR times now?:

Every time a new edition comes out, the old one suddenly moves again. Not in nearly the numbers it did when IT was the new edition, but in numbers far greater than its own recent sales. It happened when 2e switched to 3e (all the sudden our 2e stock moved after languishing for a few years). It happened when 3.0 switched to 3.5, and when 3.5 switched to 4e (the 3.5 PHB even suddenly went for big money on the aftermarket!) AND YES, even 4e had a big resurgence when 5e came out. I quickly blew through all my store copies, AND all my player's copies (my group of 8 players all had their own books, and they all "gave" them back to me to sell).

It's a weird thing, that until now I've tended to forget would happen, because I don't personally understand it. But then, I've always adopted whatever the NEW HAWT version of the game is, for better or worse. (It makes sense, of course, to play and promote the edition that currently has books in print!)

Fire sale effect.