D&D General D&D, magic, and the mundane medieval

[Baron Opal II]

Not specifically. It is an explanation some people use as to why everyone can't use magic. You need some inborn talent to be a magician, but if it is part of your being, then you don't need any instruction (sorcerer).

 

[Crimson Longinus]

That a thing can be learned doesn't necessarily mean that anyone can learn it, at least not in any reasonable amount of time. Some things are just really difficult, and require certain aptitude for learning them to be practically possible. Not everyone can become a quantum physicist, an astronaut or an Olympic athlete.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Not specifically. It is an explanation some people use as to why everyone can't use magic. You need some inborn talent to be a magician, but if it is part of your being, then you don't need any instruction (sorcerer).

I used to think (in 2e) wizards needed to be born magical and then learn... when 3e came out with sorcerer we kind of flipped that to born that way is normally sorcerer studdied is normally wizard but sometimes either one could be making a deal with an outsider... until late 3.5 when warlock came out and we kept trying to twist 'does it have to be a demonic deal' then 4e and 5e both split even more.

I don't think I have considered you had to be born with magic to be a wizard.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

That a thing can be learned doesn't necessarily mean that anyone can learn it, at least not in any reasonable amount of time. Some things are just really difficult, and require certain aptitude for learning them to be practically possible. Not everyone can become a quantum physicist, an astronaut or an Olympic athlete.

um I don't know if this is all true... sure some would make a BETTER quantum physicist or a BETTER Olympic athlete, but I can't believe that someone born with a knack for math and theory, that is really smart and reads and retains information couldn't train to be a good athlete instead of going into physics, and I know there are people (like ones I know personally) that have WAY more a knack for physical activity and no head for numbers or computers, but there parents forced them into a college/business' path and they do okay at it.

 

[Baron Opal II]

I used to think (in 2e) wizards needed to be born magical and then learn... when 3e came out with sorcerer we kind of flipped that to born that way is normally sorcerer studdied is normally wizard but sometimes either one could be making a deal with an outsider... until late 3.5 when warlock came out and we kept trying to twist 'does it have to be a demonic deal' then 4e and 5e both split even more.

I don't think I have considered you had to be born with magic to be a wizard.

It's a setting thing. Another way I've explained my setting preference is

Are you a caster because you can? You're a wizard.
Are you a caster because you must? You're a sorcerer.
Are you a caster because you can't, but made a deal? You're a warlock.

Casting spells isn't really special in this edition, but it is a way I have the classes conform to my in setting condition.

 

[Oofta]

um I don't know if this is all true... sure some would make a BETTER quantum physicist or a BETTER Olympic athlete, but I can't believe that someone born with a knack for math and theory, that is really smart and reads and retains information couldn't train to be a good athlete instead of going into physics, and I know there are people (like ones I know personally) that have WAY more a knack for physical activity and no head for numbers or computers, but there parents forced them into a college/business' path and they do okay at it.

As a software developer I beg to differ. Some people just don't "get" how to code anything more than the simplest macros. Even some of the smartest people in the world struggle with the concepts of quantum physics. To say that some would make a better Olympic athlete is kind of like saying that if you can crawl you could run the hundred yard dash. Technically true but in an entirely different realm of capability.

I assume there needs to be some innate talent and drive to become a wizard, that there's a barrier to entry of natural aptitude in addition to opportunity to learn in both having a teacher and the time. You can't just pick up a book one day and decide to be a surgeon. Well, you could, but it's doubtful many of your patients would survive.

Do what makes sense for your world because it's all make believe but not having a passion for your career doesn't equate to not having the innate abilities to master the fundamentals.

 

[J.Quondam]

(It also works the other way: Just because a wizard knows magic doesn't mean they have the training or talent to teach it to someone else.)

 

[GMforPowergamers]

As a software developer I beg to differ. Some people just don't "get" how to code anything more than the simplest macros.

this smacks of BS gate keeping "your too dumb to learn what I know"
it may come easier to some and harder to others (and to be fair a lot of people give up on hard things) but I doubt short of a major mental issue there is any thing that CAN be taught that someone can't learn.

Even some of the smartest people in the world struggle with the concepts of quantum physics.

you mean those people who put there effort elsewhere (maybe even place that it came easier)

To say that some would make a better Olympic athlete is kind of like saying that if you can crawl you could run the hundred yard dash. Technically true but in an entirely different realm of capability.

Again, unless you have a physical (as opposed to above mental one) condition yeah if you can do it you can push and learn (and again some people it comes easier for and some harder) to do anything.

I assume there needs to be some innate talent and drive to become a wizard, that there's a barrier to entry of natural aptitude in addition to opportunity to learn in both having a teacher and the time. You can't just pick up a book one day and decide to be a surgeon. Well, you could, but it's doubtful many of your patients would survive.

so in your mind if 10 kids decided they want to go to school to be surgeons there is some limit, some 'only some of them can learn this skill' built into human minds? How do you test for this? How do we KNOW who can't be a ______?

Do what makes sense for your world because it's all make believe but not having a passion for your career doesn't equate to not having the innate abilities to master the fundamentals.

in fantasy I can see needing inborn magic (in 2e for years we did that and even now that is sorcerer) but in real life I can't believe that people think there is a way to be born to be a surgeon or physics major...

 

[GMforPowergamers]

(It also works the other way: Just because a wizard knows magic doesn't mean they have the training or talent to teach it to someone else.)

wait we have gone from "not everyone can be a doctor" to "not all doctors can share there knowledge"?

again I get there are people who excel at things, and people who have to fight up hill to get there with hard work, but it never occurred to me people don't know people who are doing jobs that didn't come easy to them at first.

 

[DarkCrisis]

Its a game about heroes fighting monsters, not a medieval times simulator.