The new OGL 1.2, What is Victory?

[robconley]

@estar what can't you produce under 1.2 that you would have done under 1?

I couldn't use the open content of Traveller20 whose publisher passed away a few years back and is sadly no longer around to update the license.

I understand not trusting WotC more generally, totally get that, but then this is all probably moot, you may just be team ORC.

It is not just about new content. It is about not surrendering the right to build on 23 years worth of creative content. I realize it is a fine distinction between being allowed to keep a work and using the work. But it is an important one, and one that will have ramifications down the line. As it does for other creative fields. I recommend the below as a starting point for the larger issue.

Orphan Work

But otherwise, is there something you wanted to do and can't do under 1.2?

Assuming that we are talking about new work licensed under 1.2. It is not as good of a deal as the OGL 1.0a, Creative Commons, or any number of other options I have. And I have no desire to require folks to submit to my moral judgments when sharing the content I make. If something arises then I will deal with it then and in accordance with the circumstances. As I have already done in the past with the incident I related.

 

[robconley]

I am pretty sure wizards could change nothing, and just give away their entire IP, and people would still be upset.

Yes because of the dozens of third-party publishers like Gaming Ballistics, Frog God Games, that have been harmed by their inept handling of the whole affairs. Or the dozens of Kickstarter whose fulfillment have been thrown into disarray caused by the uncertainty. If you don't believe then email some of these publishers and politely ask them about their experience of the past two weeks.

 

[Zardnaar]

I am pretty sure wizards could change nothing, and just give away their entire IP, and people would still be upset.

I think at this point, your average player is going to lose interest in this fight, wizards walked back everything except for a small portion that few people really care about, except for the vocal minority of creators.

Feuer und blute for WotC.

 

[Aspirinsmurf]

I haven't trusted WotC ever. I trust that the OGL 1.0a will hold up in court if they decide to sue me for copyright infringement. It's a perpetual, worldwide license. It's also designed to be viral, i.e. self-replicating.

To the extent that the license agreement is somehow ambiguous or shoddy at achieving this, there are clear statements of intent in their old FAQ and on old news servers. And while that might well be irrelevant to some court in Texas or wherever (I don't know), it's pretty much the next step in trying to figure out what the parties have actually agreed to where I live.

I have no present interest in signing up for any new terms, no matter the terms.

 

[robconley]

\

I'm not talking about OSRIC. I'm talking about old OOP books from the 2000s and not having to scrub them of any Owlbear™'s because Hasbro decided to illegally violate a contract in order to reclaim IP that they've already put out under a CC-like license.

Yup for instance this

DriveThruRPG

www.drivethrurpg.com

Which has this

We can ask @Morrus how long it will be until Enworld can spare the time to update this so that its open content is usable by others. If for some reason the choice is the OGL 1.2 then a fair amount of work is required since at this time only the 5.1 SRD is going to be released as open content.

 

[The Stray]

Feuer und blute for WotC.

WotC wants blut und boden.

 

[Aspirinsmurf]

I am pretty sure wizards could change nothing, and just give away their entire IP, and people would still be upset.

I think at this point, your average player is going to lose interest in this fight, wizards walked back everything except for a small portion that few people really care about, except for the vocal minority of creators.

That was a purposeful ploy on their part. Some of it (the "deauthorization" stuff they keep skirting) is likely illegal misrepresentation too, if my admittedly restricted knowledge of common law gleaned from Wikipedia is anything to go by. From where I live, it's looking more like straight criminal fraud if they actually strong-armed anyone to sign away any existing rights on that basis.

Door-in-the-face technique - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[The Stray]

That was a purposeful ploy on their part. Some of it (the "deauthorization" stuff they keep skirting) is likely illegal misrepresentation too, if my admittedly restricted knowledge of common law gleaned from Wikipedia is anything to go by. Where I live, it's looking more like straight criminal fraud if they actually strong-armed anyone to sign away any existing rights on that basis.

Door-in-the-face technique - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I've been seeing this mentioned in some form or another for the last few weeks. But I think they miscalculated how willing to fight the people they slammed are the first time around, since they tried to get 3pps to sign on to a "sweetheart deal" on the OGL 1.1. Someone kept receipts and mailed them out, and WotC now has a blowback that's tanking their stock.

 

[Aspirinsmurf]

Someone should seek injunctive relief. Their behavior is causing ongoing, irreparable harm in my honest opinion.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I am pretty sure wizards could change nothing, and just give away their entire IP, and people would still be upset.

I think at this point, your average player is going to lose interest in this fight, wizards walked back everything except for a small portion that few people really care about, except for the vocal minority of creators.

Mod Note:

The second half of your post is fine. The first part is needlessly provocative. People ARE upset, yes, and openings like that are more likely to push buttons than smooth things over.