WotC may have sent the Pinkertons to a magic leakers home. Update: WotC confirms it and has a response.

[Zardnaar]

In the same way that you are under no obligation to help a little old lady whose handbag is being stolen, this is true.

Clearly, WotC is not a little old lady, but if you are not prepared to help them because you hate corporations, then it's clearly understandable that they will help themselves by hiring someone who will.

In principle, morality does not change depending on if you like the entity wronged or not.

You talk a big game about morality butvthis to corporate American rubbish has been actively ruining my country since the 80's.

I'll generally always side with the small guy over a corporation unless they're blatantly breaking a fair contract or stealing from them.

WotC might have a distribution problem. That's their problem.

 

[delericho]

By that logic every Youtuber who shows magic cards on their videos should then be sued for copyright, no? Is it only a copyright violation when the set breaks street date? It either is or it isn't.

There's a gap between "could be" and "should be". As I said, it's the sort of low-level copyright infringement that companies mostly don't seem to care about. That doesn't mean they don't have the ability to make an example if they feel the need to do so.

 

[Olrox17]

It's worth bearing in mind that by posting the details of those cards (and especially the artwork) he has probably broken copyright. (With the crucial caveat that I'm not a lawyer!) It's the sort of low-level infringement that companies mostly don't seem to care about... until they do.

Possibly. I’m fairly sure WotC could have gotten YouTube to take down the guy’s video, maybe inflicting a copyright strike in the process.
Anything more than that? I’m not a copyright lawyer, but I doubt they could have accomplished anything more than bleeding the guy for legal fees. Of course, in the US, being threatened with legal action by a mega corp is often enough to give people pause, even if the corp is flat-out wrong legal wise, but that’s another problem entirely.

 

[Dausuul]

By that logic every Youtuber who shows magic cards on their videos should then be sued for copyright, no? Is it only a copyright violation when the set breaks street date? It either is or it isn't.

I am not a lawyer and fair use is a weird and wily beastie... but if you're showing a big part of an entire set, and Wizards didn't send it to you as part of a "spoiler" campaign, I'm fairly sure that is a copyright violation, yes. Whether WotC pursues it is up to them.

They mostly don't, for a variety of reasons, and not even Hasbro could afford to sue every violator. But that doesn't make it legal. The Internet is a vast ocean of copyright violations.

Morally? There's a lot to debate there... but it certainly isn't cut-and-dried.

 

[Bedrockgames]

He had something he was not entitled too. If a shop keeper gives your the wrong thing the correct ethical decision is to give it back. Not go "ha ha I got one over on filthy shopkeepers everywhere!" And the idea that these are things of equal value is false. Unreleased information (i.e. secrets) are worth far more than public information. Once the secret becomes public it's value is destroyed.

Maybe I don’t know enough about magic but this just seems like an issue with the shop not following its the release date. I think if the issue is they don’t want the public to see them early, the easiest solution is file a copyright claim on the video (that will almost certainly result in it coming down) and maybe a friendly call to the customer trying to amicably work something out if he agrees. But having agents show up and imply legal threats…that really feels forgive and like a very heavy handed way to handle early release of cards

By that logic every Youtuber who shows magic cards on their videos should then be sued for copyright, no? Is it only a copyright violation when the set breaks street date? It either is or it isn't.

YouTube and mist platforms have stringent rules (I believe because of the DMCA but a more legally minded person can weigh in). You don’t even need to post copyright material. If anyone files a claim it comes down (think they can also just demonetize it if they want) and you have to challenge the claim if you want to keep it up (which is not just hard but risky to yourself and your channel). So most people just give in. Channels even get bombarded with troll claims which can be a big problem. Not saying I agree with his YouTube handles copyright but if you blog, YouTube or podcast you get very aware of claims and copyright strikes, and that is easily a lever WOTC could have pulled here if they wanted to

 

[delericho]

Possibly. I’m fairly sure WotC could have gotten YouTube to take down the guy’s video, maybe inflicting a copyright strike in the process.
Anything more than that? I’m not a copyright lawyer, but I doubt they could have accomplished anything more than bleeding the guy for legal fees. Of course, in the US, being threatened with legal action by a mega corp is often enough to give people pause, even if the corp is flat-out wrong legal wise, but that’s another problem entirely.

Sure. But that doesn't change my point: Cannon's hands weren't completely clean, which means refusing to cooperate carries a risk. That risk may have had a very small chance of blowing up in his face, but it could have been ruinous.

 

[Olrox17]

Sure. But that doesn't change my point: Cannon's hands weren't completely clean, which means refusing to cooperate carries a risk. That risk may have had a very small chance of blowing up in his face, but it could have been ruinous.

Keep in mind that (as Bedrockgames explained) copyright disputes are often resolved in favor of the copyright holder even when they’re wrong. Heck, there are frequent cases of companies that don’t even hold the relevant copyright managing to take down or demonetize a video.

Fair use vs copyright is often very hard to parse in practice.
Of course, if what you’re saying is basically that mr Cannon was going to take advantage of a leaked product in its YouTube channel, and that’s not perfectly moral, sure, ok, I see the argument.

However, a lot of people’s jobs (like journalism) are about divulging leaks and revealing confidential information acquired through third parties. That’s just how it is.

 

[Bedrockgames]

Keep in mind that (as Bedrockgames explained) copyright disputes are often resolved in favor of the copyright holder even when they’re wrong. Heck, there are frequent cases of companies that don’t even hold the relevant copyright managing to take down or demonetize a video.

They don't even have to be the copyright holder. They can be a troll fishing for the creator's personal information (when you get a complaint, if you challenge it, they don't tell you any personal information about who is challenging it, beyond very rough details (I think you get an email address or something), but you have to provide name, address, etc. All kinds of stuff an identity thief could be fishing for.

 

[delericho]

Keep in mind that (as Bedrockgames explained) copyright disputes are often resolved in favor of the copyright holder even when they’re wrong. Heck, there are frequent cases of companies that don’t even hold the relevant copyright managing to take down or demonetize a video.

Sure.

Fair use vs copyright is often very hard to parse in practice.
Of course, if what you’re saying is basically that mr Cannon was going to take advantage of a leaked product in its YouTube channel, and that’s not perfectly moral, sure, ok, I see the argument.

I'm not making a moral argument at all. I was responding to a comment that "he has done literally nothing wrong", but in the eyes of the law he has (probably). And, yes, there may only have been a very small chance of WotC taking it further, and only an even smaller chance of it going horribly wrong for him. But given the worst case outcome, would you really want to take that bet?

As I said up-thread, I'm not defending WotC's actions. But Cannon probably has had the best possible outcome from all of this - it could have been much much worse.

 

[Clint_L]

WotC could have sent a lawyer with threats of legal action vs the Pinkertons.

Yes, they could have. Others have suggested that they should have sent the police. Instead, they sent investigators who put him in touch directly with WotC, since other methods of communication were not working, retrieved their property, and even reimbursed him for money that he never gave to them by supplying the product that he changed his story to claim was always his original desire.

WotC were extremely generous with him.