D&D General Does D&D (and RPGs in general) Need Edition Resets?

[Vaalingrade]

The most unquestionably popular D&D thing basically ever, Crticical Role, runs closer to the 4E god layout than AD&D.

also if we want to anecdote things, when I tried to get a friend into D&D and told of the 5E races, she immediately went for Tabaxi. This is because khajiit, of course. Regardless though like.... Modern tieflings alone completely eclipse anything from AD&D in fan popularity on a sheer fanart perspective which I think its telling

(also dragonborn warlocks aren't popular because they've always been statted better for pally)

I think the question being posed here though is 'what if we didn't give them the choice?'

 

[Micah Sweet]

Though it requires your continuous effort to maintain, and your analysis of every change that comes through (meaning, you must be made aware of whatever changes occur...exactly as MNblockhead said). Not to mention, you'll have to catch folks up to speed, if you bring in anyone new or run for a group you haven't before.

There is no zero-work option here. It's just a question of who does it, how, and why.

No argument. I'd rather do the work myself than have no control over it, any day of the week.

 

[MNblockhead]

Though it requires your continuous effort to maintain, and your analysis of every change that comes through (meaning, you must be made aware of whatever changes occur...exactly as MNblockhead said). Not to mention, you'll have to catch folks up to speed, if you bring in anyone new or run for a group you haven't before.

There is no zero-work option here. It's just a question of who does it, how, and why.

Who: the publisher.
Why: they already did the work to make the changes. They likely have some document created to track the changes for QC purposes if nothing else. It should not be that much work for them to create a PDF or change-log webpage to post the exact textual changes they made.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Who: the publisher.
Why: they already did the work to make the changes. They likely have some document created to track the changes for QC purposes if nothing else. It should not be that much work for them to create a PDF or change-log webpage to post the exact textual changes they made.

You're preaching to the choir, man. I was responding to someone who wants to do 100% of that work himself.

 

[haakon1]

I'm saying "There are stuff that D&D fans have always had issues with." "And there are stuff that other games do that D&D fans want or display improvements on D&D idea"

I’m saying I don’t think most D&D players care much about these. For the most part “good enough” rules the day. Most people just want to play and want a fun campaign. Mechanics and balance aren’t what people I know care about.

(Interesting note. I've only seen one human pure fighter played since 4e wasn't pregen or strongly nudged by the DM in a non-human-only game)

Interesting indeed. I have one in each of my 2 campaigns, both 3.5e so maybe that’s the difference?

Or more likely just the wide variety of gaming groups. For my groups, the tropes and stories for a human fighter are just really accessible and so many different ways to do it. There’s a million ways to be a fighter from history and literature.

Whereas something like Dragonborn Warlock, the gaminess of it just lands flat for me.

”I get to use a breath weapon” doesn’t begin to compare with “I can base aspects of the character on Band of Brothers, The Odyssey, and The Things They Carried.”

 

[haakon1]

Do we really need to constrain ourselves to Tolkien's shadow?

We could do worse - and we have.

 

[Minigiant]

I’m saying I don’t think most D&D players care much about these. For the most part “good enough” rules the day. Most people just want to play and want a fun campaign. Mechanics and balance aren’t what people I know care about.

Exactly.

People only care if the game supports the ideas they think are fun.
D&D doesn't cover every fun idea.
And new fun ideas appear every day and will until the world ends.

Interesting indeed. I have one in each of my 2 campaigns, both 3.5e so maybe that’s the difference?

Or more likely just the wide variety of gaming groups. For my groups, the tropes and stories for a human fighter are just really accessible and so many different ways to do it. There’s a million ways to be a fighter from history and literature.

Whereas something like Dragonborn Warlock, the gaminess of it just lands flat for me.

”I get to use a breath weapon” doesn’t begin to compare with “I can base aspects of the character on Band of Brothers, The Odyssey, and The Things They Carried.”

Exactly it's a you thing.
People are different. New people entered the medium
They are going to like different things and have different ideas of what is fun, how that fun should be handled, and whether it is better.
.
My cousin is a 25 year old DM. He never saw Band of Brothers, read The Things They Carried, and his middle and high schools were so bad I doubt he read the Odyssey.

But at his first Session 0 are character creation when I introduced him to the game, he lit up and said "I get to breath fire?!"

I mean, should we go back to where dwarves can only be fighters?
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven rogue and that was allowed.
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven cleric and that was allowed.
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven wizard and that was allowed.
Someone new will want to be a dwarven runepriest and that will be allowed.

 

[haakon1]

The most unquestionably popular D&D thing basically ever, Crticical Role, runs closer to the 4E god layout than AD&D.

I gave up on Critical Role two episodes into the current season. My wife (not a big gamer) said: “This is unwatchable“ and I realized I had better uses for my time.

I think the “unquestionably most popular D&D thing basically ever” is Lord of the Rings books.

Right now, it’s got to be BG3, right? Which isn’t winning any argument on this thread, but who cares - it’s great! (Thus being the internet no doubt someone disagree.)

Modern tieflings alone completely eclipse anything from AD&D in fan popularity on a sheer fanart perspective which I think its telling

I love Tolkien, but I do like Tieflings. Not sure what edition first had them, but I first started paying attention in 3e. I read in Dungeon Magazine that Wolfgang Baur named them, so probably created late in the AD&D era or in 2e?

(also dragonborn warlocks aren't popular because they've always been statted better for pally)

I paired them because I dislike both. Poor Wyll.

 

[haakon1]

I mean, should we go back to where dwarves can only be fighters?
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven rogue and that was allowed.
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven cleric and that was allowed.
Someone new wanted to be a dwarven wizard and that was allowed.
Someone new will want to be a dwarven runepriest and that will be allowed.

I run 3.5e, so issues like these were resolved by then. (Except runepriest.)

I’m well aware that the mainstream is never going back to anything older.

What I’m basically saying is, you all are already playing 5e. (I’m essentially not.) 5e is by far the most liked edition ever. Don’t go “fixing“ what’s nit broken and screwing it up.

 

[Minigiant]

I run 3.5e, so issues like these were resolved by then. (Except runepriest.)

I’m well aware that the mainstream is never going back to anything older.

What I’m basically saying is, you all are already playing 5e. (I’m essentially not.) 5e is by far the most liked edition ever. Don’t go “fixing“ what’s nit broken and screwing it up.

The latest edition is usually the most popular one.

When 6e happens, 6e will likely be more liked than 5e by adding stuff 5e wanted and were houserulng as kludges. Even the designers admit 5e has pain points.

There will always be new ideas too good to ignore
There will always be old ideas that are bad but get out of playtest or are forced through due to designer bias.

Sometimes an idea can be both.

A new idea that starts bad but takes several editions to make good. (ie the rogue)

A new idea that starts bad, stays bad, but is so beloved as a concept that D&D keeps creating and stealing new ideas hoping some combinations of them works (ie MONK)