D&D 5E Do we need a Fifth Edition Revival (5ER)?

[Oofta]

Ah you are referring to that other article, ok.

Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear.

 

[Jacob Lewis]

More high-level content, balanced encounter math, functional magic item economies, better tactical play options (similar to BG3). While some of the 3PP 5e-compatible stuff may address these features for me, I can't say that official 5e is a "complete game" that spans everything that I need. It doesn't even address what was covered in every other edition of the game. It doesn't even provide examples of what that type of play looks like. It doesn't even touch the breadth of content that was available in the first year of publication of 3rd or 4th editions.
It's an anemic system.

That's kind of my point, though. People (i.e. customers at large ) expect a "complete" system, but no edition has ever proved satisfactory throughout every level if play for everyone. Then again, not everyone needs/wants certain things. And it seems that the few areas that need addressing have been addressed by outside sources. Isn't that what these "revivals" and "renaissances" do, anyway?

Personally, I feel there is a lot less hemming and hawing over these ill-perceived issues from people who spend less time looking for them online and just enjoying the games they get to play, warts and all. Games like these are supposed to be fun, not contentious and overly-analyzed.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

I just get tired of constant "The sky is falling" threads.

Then don't click on them.

 

[M.T. Black]

Hmmm. I'd ask, though, why does it need to compete on WotC's scale? If just a few thousand people happily play a 5E-based game, enough to support the line, with a dozen or so 3PPs for it, does it matter that WotC is over there being big?

I do agree. In my last paragraph I suggest the "golden age" of 5E might be replaced by a "silver age" that is led by 3PP 5E developers. What I'd like to see is an ongoing 5E scene that is as vibrant and creative as the OSR. It's the sort of environment that A5E would thrive in.

 

[delericho]

I think it's too soon to be talking about a 5e revival, largely because we don't know what the 2024 revision will bring in terms of the OGL/CC - it's possible that the pendulum within WotC has now swung back towards being more open, and an update to the SRD quickly follows the new books; it's perhaps more likely that no such update will even be needed (due to compatibility).

(Not to mention, of course, that we don't know how the market will react to the new books. It may well be that people upgrade en masse, rendering a revival almost entirely moot.)

 

[Retreater]

Personally, I feel there is a lot less hemming and hawing over these ill-perceived issues from people who spend less time looking for them online and just enjoying the games they get to play, warts and all. Games like these are supposed to be fun, not contentious and overly-analyzed.

I don't know. My 5e players (who don't spend much time online like I do) certainly complain that ...
1) they don't get enough magic item rewards
2) don't get to high levels (campaigns retire around 10th level)
3) feel that encounters are way too easy (or have TPKs - very little "happy medium")
4) don't get enough "cool things to do"

In fact, my wife was just complaining this morning while playing BG3 that she doesn't get to have "cool encounters" in D&D like she does in BG3. That's largely because there's no guidance for interacting with the environment, bonuses for height or flanking (aside from Advantage). "I wish I got cool magic arrows - they're all over the place in this game!" (No guidance for that, either, in 5e.)
Exploding barrels of oil? Creating slippery surfaces? Swinging on ropes or chandeliers? Pushing a boulder into a swarm of goblins?
None of this stuff is in 5e. The game would be improved if the options were there, in my opinion.

 

[LordEntrails]

I'd respond that the 5E community is still very Hasbro-centric and concerned with playing the "official rules" in the "right way."

So? The rules are in the Creative Commons now. If people are playing it in the Hasbro way, its because that's what they want. The edge cases are welcome to go play on the edge. And I think their is plenty of evidence that they are.

More so, we need an active community that shares and cultivates new ideas, mechanics, and experiences in the 5E space.

Why? Why do we, either DMs or Players, need that? Millions are playing with what they have. They are having fun and joying themselves. It's not like they have run out of enjoyment have they?

No one is ripping apart 5E and rebuilding it the way that, say, Whitehack or the Black Sword Hack have done in the OSR movement.

I don't think most D&D fans want that. IMO the game has grown with 5E because of its openness. You don't have to dedicate your life to it in order to play it enjoyable.

 

[Oofta]

I think it's too soon to be talking about a 5e revival, largely because we don't know what the 2024 revision will bring in terms of the OGL/CC - it's possible that the pendulum within WotC has now swung back towards being more open, and an update to the SRD quickly follows the new books; it's perhaps more likely that no such update will even be needed (due to compatibility).

(Not to mention, of course, that we don't know how the market will react to the new books. It may well be that people upgrade en masse, rendering a revival almost entirely moot.)

Especially since they cracked the door to 3PP in DDB, that to me indicates they might be embracing 3PP even more. They're just dipping their toes in the water now of course, but if being a broker for 3PP materials is profitable I see no reason they're not going to pursue it. If they can't make money off of 3PP with a revised OGL (which was always a bad idea) maybe they can make money off of being a storefront.

Whether or not it's a good thing that DDB could become the Amazon of D&D compliant material is open to debate, but 3PP will go where the sales are.

 

[LordEntrails]

I do agree. In my last paragraph I suggest the "golden age" of 5E might be replaced by a "silver age" that is led by 3PP 5E developers. What I'd like to see is an ongoing 5E scene that is as vibrant and creative as the OSR. It's the sort of environment that A5E would thrive in.

All this talk (not just yours and not just this thread) of the OSR being some shining beacon that floods the world with joy. I just don't see it. I've been in this hobby since Holmes and all I see of the OSR is a bright shining light that is about 40 watts compared to the 50,000 watt halogen that is 5E. I'm happy the OSR is bright and vibrant, but its not for the masses, and never will be.

Cold Beer & Cheeseburgers makes a better burger than McDonalds, but more people still eat at McD's.

 

[M.T. Black]

I think it's too soon to be talking about a 5e revival, largely because we don't know what the 2024 revision will bring in terms of the OGL/CC - it's possible that the pendulum within WotC has now swung back towards being more open, and an update to the SRD quickly follows the new books; it's perhaps more likely that no such update will even be needed (due to compatibility).

It does seem likely that there will be an increasing focus on digital D&D via their own portal, and they are perhaps opening the door on micro-transactions. For Hasbro, I think the D&D future is digital and subscription based, regardless of what happens mechanically. I think there's room for a thriving 5E ecosystem to exist outside that.