D&D General Social Pillar Mechanics: Where do you stand?

[Voadam]

I'm not really familiar with 5E I can't speak to that, I stopped playing D&D with the release of 4E and moved to Pathfinder and only play the first edition of it. In 3.x/Pathfinder skills can be a big deal and if I dumped a bunch off skill points into Bluff, Diplomacy and/or Intimidate then bought the feat Skill Focus to increase at least one of those and had to roleplay all social encounters and never got to roll I would, rightfully, be aggravated.

I guess this becomes the issue with a thread not related to a specific edition of D&D, we end up talking about different games.

5e the big factors are charisma bonus and either no proficiency bonus or skilled in the skill for proficiency bonus (+2 to +6 depending on level) or for rogue and bard a medium level class feature of expertise which doubles proficiency bonus for a skill.

So it is a choice of whether you are playing one of the four charisma classes or not, whether you put one of your skills into persuasion instead of perception or arcana or stealth and if you are a bard or rogue whether you put your expertise in a social skill or something else.

Not really the feat investment stuff that 3e had and not really a big let down of opportunity costs unless you are investing in charisma in a non charisma class and giving up stuff to pump into charisma.

 

[MichaelSomething]

It's strange that my group wants me to roll a dice instead of act it out in character.

Like when I wanted to perform a show stopping musical number.
Or when I wanted to use advanced integration on a captured NPC.
Or when I distracted that guard by flirting with them.
Or when I challenged that NPC to a soy sauce on ice cream eating competition.

 

[billd91]

I'm not really familiar with 5E I can't speak to that, I stopped playing D&D with the release of 4E and moved to Pathfinder and only play the first edition of it. In 3.x/Pathfinder skills can be a big deal and if I dumped a bunch off skill points into Bluff, Diplomacy and/or Intimidate then bought the feat Skill Focus to increase at least one of those and had to roleplay all social encounters and never got to roll I would, rightfully, be aggravated.

I guess this becomes the issue with a thread not related to a specific edition of D&D, we end up talking about different games.

For cases like that, as a DM I might just waive a roll for situations where a well-skilled PC was taking care of a relatively easy task (for them) while making less invested characters roll. I do that now with 5e for some knowledge-based checks. If a PC has history or nature, I'll just give them information that I'd make someone not trained it roll for.

I used to do that for a certain tumbling swashbuckler in the 3.5 game I ran as well because she had taken her tumbling score high enough to maneuver through threatened spaces and succeed on a 1. The shift in PF1 to make that harder was understandable but also FAR TOO HARSH (in my humble opinion).

 

[CreamCloud0]

I'm not really familiar with 5E I can't speak to that, I stopped playing D&D with the release of 4E and moved to Pathfinder and only play the first edition of it. In 3.x/Pathfinder skills can be a big deal and if I dumped a bunch off skill points into Bluff, Diplomacy and/or Intimidate then bought the feat Skill Focus to increase at least one of those and had to roleplay all social encounters and never got to roll I would, rightfully, be aggravated.

I guess this becomes the issue with a thread not related to a specific edition of D&D, we end up talking about different games.

i mean, is having your mechanical investment rendered obsolete because your GM preferrs to RP all the social scenes an issue that'd be limited to a specific edition?

 

[CreamCloud0]

It's strange that my group wants me to roll a dice instead of act it out in character.

Like when I wanted to perform a show stopping musical number.
Or when I wanted to use advanced integration on a captured NPC.
Or when I distracted that guard by flirting with them.
Or when I challenged that NPC to a soy sauce on ice cream eating competition.

but it's somehow entirely NOT strange to you that they want you to roll a dice rather than acting it out when

your character makes an attack with their weapon?
or when you attempt to dodge out the way of a breath weapon?
or when you try to move a stone statue?
or when you try to climb up the side of a cliff?

 

[MichaelSomething]

but it's somehow entirely NOT strange to you that they want you to roll a dice rather than acting it out when

your character makes an attack with their weapon?
or when you attempt to dodge out the way of a breath weapon?
or when you try to move a stone statue?
or when you try to climb up the side of a cliff?

In the past, I have advocated for Double Dare style physical challenges. They would be the perfect tool to more accurately simulate in character action.

 

[Reynard]

In the past, I have advocated for Double Dare style physical challenges. They would be the perfect tool to more accurately simulate in character action.

I would watch this show.

Wait, it used to be on but it never got renewed. ::sad::

 

[CreamCloud0]

In the past, I have advocated for Double Dare style physical challenges. They would be the perfect tool to more accurately simulate in character action.

double dare?

 

[Lanefan]

That would also be possible.

"This rule applies to all player characters"

Or this one

"This rule only applies to non player characters"

Done.

Nope. Hard nope.

Why?

Because there's nothing in the fiction differentiating, say, a PC Dwarf from an NPC Dwarf. They don't wear stickers or t-shirts saying "PC" or "NPC" on them, and nor should they. PC/NPC should be a nonexistent delineator.

Yet there are things in the fiction differentiating Dwarves from Elves, or Fighters from Clerics, etc.

 

[Lanefan]

But there is no framework here at all. The system really does not even have rules for social encounters.

Exactly, and it works better that way.

Frankly the closest things to concise social encounter rules is the charm spell, because at least that thing is pretty predictable in what it allows you to do.

Which is telling in itself, that you associate social encounter rules with mind control; and helps make my case for me that such rules would play hell with player agency over their characters.