D&D (2024) D&D species article

[Charlaquin]

Brute force counting gives me 17. I am pretty confident I didn't double-count or miss one but I'm not a maths wizz either.

According to a quick google search, there are 20 unique combinations that can be made using three items from a group of six.

EDIT: And my own count agrees. To show my work:

1,2,3
1,2,4
1,2,5
1,2,6
1,3,4
1,3,5
1,3,6
1,4,5
1,4,6
1,5,6

2,3,4
2,3,5
2,3,6
2,4,5
2,4,6
2,5,6

3,4,5
3,4,6
3,5,6

4,5,6

 

[Clint_L]

You could have every elf in your campaign setting use human stats and still retain a distinct "elven" culture for them - no one is claiming otherwise - yet elves are still allowed to retain their own species mechanics as well, because people want elves to feel different than humans.

Species mechanics that are adaptations; while I've already said that I am somewhat uncomfortable with specific spells being in that category, I suppose you could make a case for it. But ability scores and proficiencies, etc. are being largely moved to background, which both makes more sense and is a lot less problematic.

Same with dwarves, or tieflings, or anything else.

Saying mixed-ancestry characters don't need distinct mechanics because you can just give them a distinct culture is tantamount to saying that nobody needs species mechanics at all, yet they're the only one's being stuck with "hand-me-downs" from their parent ancestries.

I don't understand. Every character is stuck with their "hand me downs" from their parent ancestry. However, if you choose a mixed species character you can choose which "hand me down" to take.

Beyond that, with the notable exception of Khoravar from Eberron, how many mixed-ancestry groups in D&D have historically been given their own distinct cultural identity separate from their parent ancestries? Because where you seem to see a vast increase in the possibility for all kinds of new mixed-ancestry characters, I see what mechanical identity the "half-elf" and "half-orc" actually had being stripped away without replacement and little to no incentive being provided for writers, DMs, or players to bother even considering mixed-ancestry characters at all ever again, much less entire culturally distinct societies comprised of them.

The incentive is the story of the character. I think this incentivizes players to be creative instead of being stuck with two tired tropes that are only there because Tolkien.

At best, I expect we'll see more one-off, "I'm the result of a chance encounter between an X and a Y" type characters - lone first-generation individuals who may well never meet another of their kind, not a people with a shared mixed heritage that possess their own distinct culture.

I guess we'll see. I think we'll see a lot more creativity. I trust the players to come up with the character background that speaks to them. And the "half-X" terminology is gone for reasons that go beyond the game, and that's a good thing.

 

[Argyle King]

Not only can you still make a half-elf, you can now make a half-anything. And you can make them a "distinct group all of their own" as much as you like. Different human groups don't get their distinctiveness from unique abilities, they get their uniqueness from forging their own culture.

Edit: for example, here in Canada the Metis are a distinct group all their own not because of an ability score increase or darkvision or something, but because of historical circumstance and culture.

It's still a miss for me.

Struggling with mixed heritage -being simultaneously both yet situationally neither- is a story to which I can relate. Given the focus on inclusivity for 5e24, it's a bit jarring to feel as though a piece of my own experience is deemed less important to the game as we move forward.

=======

In general, this particular preview of 5e24 is a miss for me. From a more specific and personally subjective view, it's a critical miss.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Honestly, I'm just going to use the Custom Background all the time, because I want my background to fit my character like a tailored suit.

I will offer my players the custom background consistently as well, so they can tailor them as they see fit.

I am annoyed this was made a DMG option, but I can tolerate as I understand some people just want to grab an option off the shelf and run with it.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Brute force counting gives me 17. I am pretty confident I didn't double-count or miss one but I'm not a maths wizz either.

I'm fairly sure it's 20. You've six picks for your first stat, and five remaining for your second so thirty combos - but you're double counting (because you could have picked either order). For your third there are four remaining - and you divide by three because you've equivalent triplets (As AB/C, AC/B, and BC/A are now all the same even if we've already weeded out BA/C). It's a long time since I studied this.

LOL the classism, the stereotyping, but America, what more can I expect! If INT, for example, meant formal education that'd be one thing, but 150% absolutely totally doesn't even slightly mean that, especially given how many monsters have extremely high INTs despite "no formal education" lol.

On the other hand it does seem to be what it means for PCs. Mostly. It's not well defined.

 

[Veltharis ap Rylix]

Yeah but there are 16 Backgrounds and 17 combinations of stats.

Breaks out the combinatorics formulae

Mathmatically, 6 choose 3 (that is, choose 3 values out of a set of 6 possible values, without accounting for the order they're chosen in) is 20 possible combinations.

To enumerate:

1. STR/DEX/CON
2. STR/DEX/INT
3. STR/DEX/WIS
4. STR/DEX/CHA
5. STR/CON/INT
6. STR/CON/WIS
7. STR/CON/CHA
8. STR/INT/WIS
9. STR/INT/CHA
10. STR/WIS/CHA
11. DEX/CON/INT
12. DEX/CON/WIS
13. DEX/CON/CHA
14. DEX/INT/WIS
15. DEX/INT/CHA
16. DEX/WIS/CHA
17. CON/INT/WIS
18. CON/INT/CHA
19. CON/WIS/CHA
20. INT/WIS/CHA

 

[Clint_L]

It's still a miss for me.

Struggling with mixed heritage -being simultaneously both yet situationally neither- is a story to which ai can relate. Given the focus on inclusivity for 5e24, it's a bit jarring to feel as though a piece of my own experience is deemed less important to the game as we move forward.

=======

In general, this particular preview of 5e24 is a miss for me. From a more specific and personally subjective view, it's a critical miss.

Your own experience as a half-elf or half-orc?

What about the game opening up mixed ancestry to all imaginable combinations, making them all valid, makes it less inclusive? It's radically more inclusive. By many orders of magnitude!

As opposed to the current version, which repeats IRL stigmas about "half-X" by making them into a completely distinct species as if the most important thing about them is their mixed parentage. And singles out just two to acknowledge.

 

[Veltharis ap Rylix]

I don't understand. Every character is stuck with their "hand me downs" from their parent ancestry. However, if you choose a mixed species character you can choose which "hand me down" to take.

So it's better because instead of just getting to be what they are, they instead get to choose which fraction of what they are overwrites the rest?

A human uses the human mechanics because they are human.
An elf uses the elf mechanics because they are an elf.
A Khoravar has to choose which part of them is purely cosmetic.

The incentive is the story of the character. I think this incentivizes players to be creative instead of being stuck with two tired tropes that are only there because Tolkien.

No one is saying that only "half-elves" and "half-orcs" should be allowed to keep distinct mechanics, just that throwing them out so that only "pure" ancestries get their own distinct mechanics isn't the right approach either.

I have repeatedly said that I want a system that can let ANY mixed ancestry have its own distinct mechanics. An optional species trait mix-and-match system in the DMG, subject to DM approval, would resolve my concerns completely.

I guess we'll see. I think we'll see a lot more creativity. I trust the players to come up with the character background that speaks to them. And the "half-X" terminology is gone for reasons that go beyond the game, and that's a good thing.

You'll get no argument from me over the retirement of the "half-X" terminology. The only reason I still use "half-elf" and "half-orc" on occasion is that we don't currently have agreed upon, setting-neutral replacements. My go-to options of Khoravar/Aiuvarin and Jhor'guntaal/Dromaar don't mean anything outside of Eberron and Golarion.

 

[Argyle King]

Your own experience as a half-elf or half-orc?

What about the game opening up mixed ancestry to all imaginable combinations, making them all valid, makes it less inclusive? It's radically more inclusive. By many orders of magnitude!

As opposed to the current version, which repeats IRL stigmas about "half-X" by making them into a completely distinct species as if the most important thing about them is their mixed parentage. And singles out just two to acknowledge.

My own experience as belonging to multiple groups. I don't see that as less valid than other creatures and options among which people have been able to envision themselves or explore some semblance of identity through roleplay.

While I understand the idea of "opening up" options by being able to just say you're of two heritages, that doesn't (in my mind) adequately cover what was represented by half-orcs and half-elves previously. There are reasons why those two specific options were previously highlighted as options and why they were two different reflections of the same thing (as well as humanity's varying attitudes toward them).

Most notably, living that experience is not as simple as 'I look like X but I am functionally Y.'

I don't expect the game to bend to my own viewpoint. Sometimes, something doesn't fit a creative vision, and I am fine with that. At the same time, it feels a bit off to juxtapose the loss of mixed-heritage options (that I identified with) against the new cornucopia of goliath options and other such changes.

While, as an individual, I tend to have thick skin and wouldn't go so far as to say I am offended by the 5e24 approach; it certainly feels like a step in the wrong direction (especially given DEI design concerns,) and I can see how others might feel more marginalized by 5e24.

 

[Remathilis]

The PHB will have official conversion rules for older Backgroinds already.

Partially my point. Even if they don't specifically call out "a feylost has X, Y, and Z", it should be either able to be done easily or someone will do it and put it on DMs Guild.