You keep presenting the idea that they are going to market their new product as somehow sinister or dangerous.
In point of fact, I've presented it as neither. I'm just saying that I think there's the possibility of (what I presume are, from WotC's point of view) unintended consequences to what they're trying to do, at least in the event that they succeed.
The rules are the product that WoTC is selling.
That
was the case, but now they're also selling the digital interface, as well as everything therein (hence the virtual gold dragon mini).
They are the thing that will "dovetail" into how the VTT is run according to you.
Yes, I think it's entirely plausible that WotC will want the game rules to work in conjunction with what the VTT does best as much as possible, with everything else being less important to their consideration.
So your fear is either that WoTC is going to change the rules (which is something you keep insisting they will do to support the VTT)
You're the one who said that your group hasn't ever created a custom spell that you recall, and that the rules don't have very much in the way of custom spell creation. Are you suggesting that the lack of rules in support of that option have nothing to do with your group's ignoring that option so completely? Now, how prominent do you think that custom spell creation will be under the VTT interface, which prioritizes things like spell animation? Because I suspect it won't be
more prominent than it is now. That's just one example of the issue I'm talking about.
or that people will change how they play DnD...
Because if the VTT incentivizes certain things and disincentivizes others, then yes that's going to have an impact on how people interface with the game.
which is an especially bizarre take for you to be ringing the warning bells about.
No, it's really not; what is bizarre is your insistence that there's nothing to be concerned about when you yourself have provided an example of the issue in action wherein what's presented shapes what's played, i.e. your group following the rules and so not venturing beyond what they present. If that's not an example of the content directing play, what is?
But if they don't allow the VTT to support custom and homebrew content, then their efforts to "monetize the game through a recurrent spending environment" dies a sad and pathetic death before it even draws its first breath.
I think you're vastly overestimating the degree to which WotC's VTT will be dependent on them allowing homebrew content, as well as the degree to which such content (if it's allowed at all) will be able to interface with their system. After all, they're not going to want people to make homebrew material that
just so happens to near-identically replicate content from a sourcebook that they've recently released, and then let it be freely shared among users. That's the sort of thing which (particularly in light of the OGL fiasco) they'd likely go out of their way to disallow. Likewise, even if that custom content is allowed, it's not going to be nearly as evocative in terms of presentation, unless you think that people are going to be able to upload things like custom spell animations.
Because OTHER VTTs allow that.
Which is why WotC will be going for a different approach so as to make sure that their walled garden is still attractive to consumers, even if the walls are higher.
So if they want to offer a premium, high dollar product to get people hooked into a paid subscription but offer a product that is inferior to other FREE products, then they will crash and burn because no one with any knowledge of the VTT community will ever go for it.
Again, I think you're wrong about this. There are a lot of instances where people will pay for something that they could otherwise get for free elsewhere. Most people subscribe to streaming services at a cost even though pirating movies and TV shows for free is easy to do; the same is true for PDFs of RPG books for that matter. Convenience and ease of use is a far more salient issue than you're making it out to be.
That is a false endpoint. I still use both my Kindle and Google Docs.
And some people will still use other VTTs as well, which WotC won't care about so long as one of the ones people pay for is theirs. It's not like those other VTTs are capable of reaching the same degree of imaginative play either, even if they have less restrictive interfaces. Again, convenience and ease-of-use are factors which shouldn't be downplayed; particularly among casual players, having to fiddle with things quickly becomes something they don't want to bother with, no matter how minor an issue it is. Hence the swipe-texting instead of using your thumbs.
I just can't use Google Docs on my Kindle, instead I use my cellphone and my computer. You keep claiming the sunk-cost fallacy will link people to the WotC VTT forever, but you can't articulate what they are actually getting beyond "it will look really cool, with bells and whistles".
Except for the fact that I already have articulated what those are, several times in fact. But one more time: the micro-transaction heavy environment that WotC wants to create, along with their logged data for things which the users have made within the context of the system, disincentivizes people from leaving that environment, since that would mean leaving that all behind. You say "but there's third-party apps that let you recover some of that elsewhere," which is nice and all, but that's like saying that there are DIY videos about how to change the oil in your car; people still go to mechanics to do that for them, even knowing that it costs more.
That isn't enough. Not if it is going to lack basic functionality that I can get from six other major VTTs FOR FREE.
On the contrary, it's more than enough. Far more. You don't have to look very far to see that there are plenty of devices with greater functionality that people will overlook for myriad reasons, ranging from idiosyncratic preference to simply not knowing what else is out there. Consider someone who wants to play a DVD not even realizing that a blu-ray player can give them what they want.
Because a free discord bot is different than cracking your Iphone open and changing the hardware?
"Different" is relative. There are a lot of casual players out there who won't know or won't care about that, or simply find it too inconvenient to bother with.
Do you somehow think that the Avrae bot will somehow stop functioning in the future and will be unable to work?
You
do realize you're saying this just days after a major computer malfunction that affected myriad systems worldwide, right?
Um... probably a lot of them?
"Probably"? So how many custom spells have you seen on that platform?
Talespire isn't set up for mechanics, it is purely the aesthetics as far as I know. So everyone using it is importing mechanics.
Which means that if it's not animating specific instances of things such as particular spells or monsters, then it's probably not the best point of comparison to what WotC is doing.
And sure, WoTC doesn't need to capture the totality of the fanbase, but your concern seems to be "digital tools will change the culture of play to emphasize rules over creativity"
It's less about rules over creativity than it is the potential for creativity to be narrowed by what the medium can handle (well). It's more of a programming issue than a rules-based one. There aren't any rules about diverting a nearby river to flood a dungeon, but I don't think that the VTT will have any sort of special animations to account for something like that.
Like, chill, bruh.
it is so far too late to stop a large portion of DnD from having a "rules over creativity" mind-set.
So you're saying that you think that things are already so far gone in that regard that they can't get any worse? That's a rather odd counterargument, don't you think? I mean, yeah, the way you're describing your group makes it sound like they won't care if the range of imaginative play is contracted because they're not that imaginative themselves, but otherwise this just sounds like giving up.
We are the community that coined the terms "Rules as Written" and "Rules as Intended".
And so you're throwing your hands in the air and deciding that there's no coming back from that, that it isn't that bad anyway, all while simultaneously saying that it's not something that could ever happen. You can't really argue that it's impossible for this to occur while saying that it's already occured.
Not for you and your group, but again, I'm concerned about the hobby as a whole rather than just you.
And having fancy flashing lights and fun sounds isn't going to be enough to wrench people away from doing what they want with the rule set.
No, I think it absolutely is. There'll be some people who want to play with the new interface and push it to its limits, but most will comfortably settle for operating within those limits, to the point of disregarding aspects of imaginative play that could otherwise go beyond them.
See above; or do you think that there's going to be an expansive sourcebook about custom spell creation sourcebook released after the VTT goes live?
You just claimed above that they aren't going to be removing the rules you are concerned about. So what sort of "dovetailing" are you talking about?
Again, the digital medium becomes the focus. Expect to see fewer and fewer things that don't interface with that.
Heck, you've put forth that the very idea of the rules changing isn't your point.
Because it isn't; it's just one facet of what I'm talking about, which is the overall contraction of imaginative play. That goes just as much for the rules expanding to cover new possibilities as it does for players to push for ways to play that aren't focused on pure, enumerated crunch.
I am quantifying "incredibly common" as: I do not believe there is a single VTT on the market that does not allow for custom content to be put into their digital environment. A full zero percent of them lack this function.
And is doing so as quick, easy, and convenient as using the existing content? Do 100% of their users make their own materials? Is doing so as easy as what you can do at the tabletop? These are highly salient concerns.
Why do I think WoTC will allow what every single VTT allows? Because every single VTT allows it, and their product (D&D) is BUILT on the idea of making your own stuff, of modifying your own game.
I don't believe that WotC sees their product as being built on that idea, and if they ever did then I don't think they do anymore. They have a curated sales page which they're going to want people using, and the mere idea that people could create custom content of things instead of buying them strikes me as untenable to WotC, at least in light of the OGL debacle.
it doesn't matter if it will be a little harder to do, because it is ALREADY a little harder to make custom things than to use what is in the book.
And this makes it even harder, because now in addition to making sure that things work well with the game unto itself, you also have the added technical aspects to deal with. The more work you make it require, the less people are going to want to bother.
The creation process of homebrew material is the hardest possible part of it.
I know plenty of people who love gaming, but don't consider themselves tech-savvy, and they'd disagree. To them, homebrewing material comes very easily, but setting it up to work in a digital environment is intimidating just to think about.
Typing it into a box in a VTT is trivial in comparison. I know, because I have done it.
I'll point out again that it doesn't come back to you, and your experience isn't representative of anything beyond yourself.
