D&D General “‘Scantily Clad and Well Proportioned’: Sexism and Gender Stereotyping in the Gaming Worlds of TSR and Dungeons & Dragons.”

[Charlaquin]

Such a weird piece. Waist up it looks great, waist down and im like, "where da pants?"

NGL, there’s something very nostalgic to me about fantasy art of bare-legged heroes and heroines. This one’s clearly intentional choice to display a lack of underwear makes it weird, but if that loincloth was wider, I’d be more inclined to file this under “aspirational” than “sexual object.” Not to say the lack of pants isn’t weird, but it’s such a specific vibe. A lot of fantasy characters of all genders were out there Donald Ducking it in the 70s and 80s and it’s kind of hilarious to me.

 

[Steampunkette]

Perhaps I missed something in this conversation. Is that something you would want to use "background" to rules-model? I would think that it would be something that you would just declare your character to be, and pick something else as a background.

But if I try to answer your question: Stat Bonusses, when it comes to background, tend to be based around the sorts of things that a background would teach. The kind of vigorous "exercise" that you would have gone through during your time coming up as that background. Being cis, I wouldn't presume to know what that would entail for a "trans-woman" background (and again, I'm not sure that I'd use "background" to model the trans experience in a game - it seems like an odd fit to me).

But if you don't mind a somewhat tongue-in-cheek answer to your direct question, I'd say: CON (for your handling of the 'slings and arrows'), WIS (for figuring out who you are), and CHA (for the confidence and strength of character that comes, and was needed, to transition.)

Note: If any of the above is wrong, please forgive me. I'd like to consider myself an Ally, but I admit that I have much to learn.

Sorry, sorry...

The point was that I use Half-Elves and Half-Orcs to model that aspect of my lived experience as a trans woman through an allegorical medium. A character trapped between two worlds.

But relegating that to Background requires two things:

1) A background that is fairly narrowly defined.
2) Direct mechanical benefits in the form of attribute bonuses

(At least in the D&D24 method)

So it was a kind of off-handed jokey comment about how narrowly limiting and defining that mechanical function is for something that complex. Especially applied to that specific aspect of human experience.

It also wouldn't work great, for -me-, because I'm looking for the allegory, not to just play a trans woman in a D&D game. Not that there's anything wrong with anyone doing that, more power to you. It's just that I'm old and enjoy slipping into the old shoe rather than wearing the newer one, y'know?

But yeah... Breaking heritages out from culture was a great design decision for A5e and creates an honestly really good spot for building a character who is of "Two Worlds" without it explicitly being a mixed race thing.

Just basing this off of you alone? A +2 to Charisma I guess.

D'awww! Thank you! <3

 

[abirdcall]

Because unfortunately the 5E 2024 PHB does not (and I did check this) contain any rules allowing you to in any way edit backgrounds unless they're from 5E 2014 products in which case it basically do whatever you want. I don't remember it even having an "ask the DM if you want to change stuff" re: backgrounds, but maybe I've forgotten/overlooked it - I haven't seen it since like, weekend before last.

So RAW and RAI and all that.

I agree with you that that's how you play D&D. It is not how 5E 2024 explains you play D&D, weirdly, despite it being how the 5E 2024 playtest did it, to loud applause.

As a Tiefling fan I agree, and what's funny is, I think like, easily 95% of people who want to play a Tiefling don't want them to be a Happy Insider, but that's what they are now, by default! I feel like they should have presented them as Mistrusted Outsiders with some kind of clause to get out of that. Especially as canonically in most D&D settings they are Mistrusted Outsiders.

(I will say at least their art piece has a bit more edge and fun to it that the decidedly boring ones for say, dwarves and elves.)

The species art pieces aren't depicting adventurers. Most members of a species shouldn't be adventurers and they should be able to have lives that have joy in them.

Tieflings can still be outsiders in 5e 2024, they just find solace with each other.

 

[Chaltab]

Nope, they're gone completely. Even the sidebar from the OneDnD playtest didn't get added.

So if you're using 2024 onwards content only, playing as a mixed species is no longer allowed RAW.

When combined with how they've retconned existing mixed species characters into being single species in more recent books, it's clear they they've decided that they no longer exist in DnD.

wait who did they retcon?

 

[Steampunkette]

How does this post relate to the portrayal of women in ttrpgs? Seems like someone is venting?

It was in response to a general trend of discussion related to the use of sexual assault in stories about female characters in TTRPGs being "A Thing" which was -super- common in Early D&D and D&D Spaces and how that likely contributed to the overall homosocial nature of D&D in those early days.

But, y'know. You could've read the thread and figured that out rather than whipping out a gif and being mean to me for no discernable reason.

 

[payn]

NGL, there’s something very nostalgic to me about fantasy art of bare-legged heroes and heroines. This one’s clearly intentional choice to display a lack of underwear makes it weird, but if that loincloth was wider, I’d be more inclined to file this under “aspirational” than “sexual object.” Not to say the lack of pants isn’t weird, but it’s such a specific vibe. A lot of fantasy characters of all genders were out there Donald Ducking it in the 70s and 80s and it’s kind of hilarious to me.

Honestly, whats so confusing about it is the contrast between top and bottom. If she had on just a bikini top, or even a cleavage revealing shirt I probably wouldn't of thought anything about it. Though, the nicely detailed breastplate is just baffling with the no pants look.

 

[Steampunkette]

Always ask for permission. I work in publishing and I would never leave it to chance. If it was just a link, then you’d be safer.

Waiting on an email response... hopefully soon.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

It is a cliche that every D&D character has a tragic back story. Even so much that there are lots of jokes and memes about it.

So I think we are in no danger of people knowing how to do it.

I think it's a bit unhelpful and reductive to call "between two worlds" a "tragic backstory".

 

[Charlaquin]

My oldest son is mixed race. The idea that he's half anything is insulting, tbh. Regardless of anything else, the terminology is problematic. I imagine someone who is mixed race might* be really turned off to read a book with "half" being part of the description of multi-racial humanoids

*I say might, because I know mixed race people who weren't bothered, and those who were. Individuals being individual and all.

Individuals being individuals, yes, and also, there’s an especially wide diversity in the experiences of being mixed race. It’s such a broad term that applies to people of such wildly different backgrounds. No demographic is a monolith, and mixed race as a demographic is especially diverse.

 

[Chaltab]

Honestly, whats so confusing about it is the contrast between top and bottom. If she had on just a bikini top, or even a cleavage revealing shirt I probably wouldn't of thought anything about it. Though, the nicely detailed breastplate is just baffling with the no pants look.

I suspect that in the 80s a lot of these images tended to use models in leotards as references.