D&D General Dark Sun as a Hopepunk Setting

[GrimCo]

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Thundar the barbarian. Another 90s gem. That cartoon was fun, with it's post apocalyptic vibe. Also, that reminded me about old French cartoon that has some DS vibes. Spartacus and the Sun Beneath the Sea, from late 80s. Desert world, great cataclysm, main character with psionic powers.

 

[Corinnguard]

If we're using A5E, I wonder if a renamed version of the Zeitgeist Deva heritage would be better.

The Pyreen as Aasimar would work if the Aasimar were their own heritage (or lineage if the Planetouched heritage was written like MoAR: Complete's Goblinoid heritage).

 

[Vaalingrade]

If you don't think slavery is morally wrong, you've screwed up. You don't need to interrupt everything you do every five seconds to remind people that you know which things are good and which things are bad. It's actually pretty much okay to depict a thing without specifically going out of your way to identify whether you think it is right or wrong, and let the reader think about it.
I'm not proposing "instead, depict it as neutral" or "instead, depict it as positive". You can simply not address the question of whether a thing is morally good or bad because not everyone wants/needs to be handheld through the moral judgment process every minute of every day. You can just have a story in which some people are murderous and others aren't, and not specifically stop to say "by the way the murderous ones are bad".

This is a game that already uses slavery as filler for every third species back story and historically treated it as just a fact of life.

And a setting that used it as a kicky wacky way to start a campaign.

And a time where people one hundred percent are trying to sell the institution as not the bad.

A lack of 'handholding through moral judgement' appears to be what got us here and I'm going to look askew when someone tries to criticize taking too strong a stance against slavery.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Maybe not, but there's still no benefit to QotC in closing that door, whether or not they end up making anything.

I assume that was the reason they dialled back on destroying Athas in Spelljammer. But my personal view is that “everything dies” is the poetically appropriate ending for Athas, and would serve as a warning - which is what science fiction is for after all. And it would open up the way to rebooting Dark Sun in a 5e appropriate way with a new world facing the same fate. “They tried to save Athas. They failed. Can you do better?”

 

[EzekielRaiden]

If you don't think slavery is morally wrong, you've screwed up. You don't need to interrupt everything you do every five seconds to remind people that you know which things are good and which things are bad. It's actually pretty much okay to depict a thing without specifically going out of your way to identify whether you think it is right or wrong, and let the reader think about it.
I'm not proposing "instead, depict it as neutral" or "instead, depict it as positive". You can simply not address the question of whether a thing is morally good or bad because not everyone wants/needs to be handheld through the moral judgment process every minute of every day. You can just have a story in which some people are murderous and others aren't, and not specifically stop to say "by the way the murderous ones are bad".

Given some of the things that came to light regarding a certain citizen of North Carolina in the three-ish months preceding the second week of November (no special reason why it would be that week, nope not at all)...

No, I think we need to have some media that takes a strong stance against enslavement of other humanoids, and makes it clear exactly how awful it was as an institution, an experience for its victims, and as an economic model.

 

[Steampunkette]

I assume that was the reason they dialled back on destroying Athas in Spelljammer. But my personal view is that “everything dies” is the poetically appropriate ending for Athas, and would serve as a warning - which is what science fiction is for after all. And it would open up the way to rebooting Dark Sun in a 5e appropriate way with a new world facing the same fate. “They tried to save Athas. They failed. Can you do better?”

Sure. That is a story you can tell, and it works fine.

I'd rather tell the story "It was hellish. And people fought like hell to change it." without telling people how it ends so they get to decide for themselves what happens.

Those who like the poetic story can tell of the failure of the people who fought to save Athas. Those who like a different poetic story can tell of the success of saving Athas.

But I think we can both agree, the best story is the one we tell with our friends, in the end!

 

[mamba]

Treating adult readers like they are kids is frankly insulting.

given many adults these days, that is insulting to kids… there is a reason why newspapers and TV now write to a low grade and some politicians’ speeches are dumbed down so even imbeciles can follow them

So yeah, it needs spelling it out, unfortunately

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Sure. That is a story you can tell, and it works fine.

I'd rather tell the story "It was hellish. And people fought like hell to change it." without telling people how it ends so they get to decide for themselves what happens.

Those who like the poetic story can tell of the failure of the people who fought to save Athas. Those who like a different poetic story can tell of the success of saving Athas.

But I think we can both agree, the best story is the one we tell with our friends, in the end!

Yeah, I very much think it's best to leave it up to each group to decide whether Athas is Just Doomed and thus the heroes therein are living a beautiful tragedy, or that Athas is Very Much Fixable and thus the heroes therein are Stalwart, Brave, And True for sticking it out on the long, long road to change.

Or whether it's genuinely unknown--maybe it can be fixed, maybe it can't. Maybe there's a closing window of opportunity and once it's gone, then Athas is Just Doomed, but before that, it might be saved. That has clear stakes (even if it might not be clear how wide the window of opportunity is or when it will fully shut) beyond the lives of the player characters.

Perhaps you could even have a moment at some point where folks get to see what Athas could be in different possible timelines. One where it claws back from the brink, and another where it doesn't. Could be a profound motivator, especially if the PCs can somehow share these visions with others. "This is what COULD be, if we work together. This is what WILL be, if we fail."

 

[AnotherGuy]

given many adults these days, that is insulting to kids… there is a reason why newspapers and TV now write to a low grade and some politicians’ speeches are dumbed down so even imbeciles can follow them

Unless those making speeches are imbeciles. We could use a ven diagram but then what can be, unburdened by what has been is essentially a fool can't get fooled again as the old saying goes in Tennessee.

 

[Maxperson]

Thundar the barbarian. Another 90s gem. That cartoon was fun, with it's post apocalyptic vibe. Also, that reminded me about old French cartoon that has some DS vibes. Spartacus and the Sun Beneath the Sea, from late 80s. Desert world, great cataclysm, main character with psionic powers.

I wonder if that French cartoon is around somewhere. I never saw it.