D&D (2024) D&D Monster Manual (2025)

[Micah Sweet]

Because the formula and monster building rules, if they are to be anyway close to accurate in play, is way too complex for all but the most veteran number crunchers.

So they're too fancy for the rest of us to understand their work?

 

[dave2008]

So they're too fancy for the rest of us to understand their work?

Nah, that is just @Minigiant 's take

 

[Minigiant]

So they're too fancy for the rest of us to understand their work?

Less fancy.
More convoluted.

Like damage and HP growth are 1000% not linear.

 

[JEB]

Because the formula and monster building rules, if they are to be anyway close to accurate in play, is way too complex for all but the most veteran number crunchers.

That's only true if the 2024 monster building rules are radically more complicated than the rules they put in the 2014 DMG, or the more accurate reverse-engineered rules others have put together.

 

[Minigiant]

That's only true if the 2024 monster building rules are radically more complicated than the rules they put in the 2014 DMG, or the more accurate reverse-engineered rules others have put together.

It likely is.

2014s rules were under tuned

 

[dave2008]

It likely is.

2014s rules were under tuned

Under tuned as nothing to do with being more complicated. I am 100% sure the could give us a version of the rules they are using to design the 2024 monsters that would not be more complex than the 2014 version. They may not, but they could. Does that mean they would work for every group, no that is an impossible task for CR and was never the intent of the monster building rules.

I plan to reverse engineer them myself. If we ever get an official version I will see how close I got!

 

[Micah Sweet]

It likely is.

2014s rules were under tuned

Fixing that would not necessarily make them radically overcomplicated. Other 5e games have done it.

 

[Minigiant]

Under tuned as nothing to do with being more complicated. I am 100% sure the could give us a version of the rules they are using to design the 2024 monsters that would not be more complex than the 2014 version. They may not, but they could. Does that mean they would work for every group, no that is an impossible task for CR and was never the intent of the monster building rules.

I plan to reverse engineer them myself. If we ever get an official version I will see how close I got!

It was under tuned BECAUSE it was too simplistic.

Monster design in Tier 1 is different from monster design in Tier 2 or monster design in Tier 3 or monster design in Tier 3.

Getting a monster creation chapter that doesn't spawn "LOL WOTC's Monster creation rules suck and are super bad" videos in 2 weeks would likely take up more page count than WOTC would create or most fans would read.

WOTC is actually better off designing a monster builder on DND beyond that lets you pick a CR, monster role, theme, and equipment then do all the math behind the scenes.

 

[mellored]

Yes, straight up resistance to all BPS damage, much more impactful. So much so I can't really wrap my head around it. I mean the 2014 CR rules didn't provide for an adjustment for resistance on CR17+ creatures, but how could this not affect the CR? This makes me more frustrated they have not included new monster building rules

From the tidbits I heard, it's not a universal change. Only a few monsters will have B/P/S resistance.

Werewolves don't have it, for instance.

 

[mellored]

We don't have a lot of actual stat block previews yet; however, here are some examples of revised old stat blocks:

• the new Empyrean does 68% more damage. It also has an auto-stun effect.
• The new cyclops can do any combination of ranged and melee attacks with its multiattack and it has the Reaction "Limited Foresight"
• The Kuo-toa was given a new reaction (I don't have that one in front of me at the moment).

The only other previews we have of existing monsters are the skeletons and ancient green dragon. The skeletons didn't change much. The green dragon changed a lot and added lots of interesting options; however, it seems like it will change based on these new newer previews.

Cyclops also now knocks prone.