D&D General No One Reads Conan Now -- So What Are They Reading?

[Belen]

As the dad of an 8 year-old, there's tons of content out there that's she's enjoying. It's just not comic books like I grew up with. I think that was right when I started reading comic books and I still check out stores in my area every now and then. It's definitely not targeted at young kids.

Edited to add: when I go with my daughter for crafting supplies, there's tons of stuff there for Avengers and Spider Man ... just not at the comic store.

I should have said companies like Marvel and DC. My son loves Batman but has to get his fix through older media.

Even toys are targeted to adult collectors rather than kids. It is sad.

 

[Voranzovin]

I'd argue that the decline of Conan's relevancy is related not just to his age, or the degree to which he is or isn't read, but to the degree that the "barbarian" figure--the figure free from the constraints of civilization, who relies on extreme athleticism, cunning/craftiness, and wild daring to overcome problems soft civilized folk cannot--isn't a very strong heroic fantasy anymore. That's not to say that this figure is entirely gone from pop culture (I mean, isn't Jack Reacher basically Conan?), but the fantasy just doesn't hold the power it used to.

When I was growing up in the 80s, my fantasies of heroism encompassed figures like Robin Hood, Luke Skywalker, D'Artagnan, and Aragorn. As I became a teenager, with a teenager's desire for things that are edgy and bada**, it shifted to include figures like Blade and Sanjuro. On that list, only Sanjuro comes close to being a "barbarian," but he's not really uncivilized, just disreputable. His heroic value isn't that he rejects the skills of civilization for something wild and elemental, but that he's even better at them then reputable samurai. I could understand the appeal of Conan, but he never really spoke to me at all personally. My daughter, on the other hand, just finds him baffling. They can't even see what the appeal is in the first place.

To me, this seems to be to be related to the way the world has changed in the last hundred years. When REH was writing Conan stories, he was reacting against the interconnectedness of the world--already in full swing both politically and technologically--and his fantasy was a rejection of that "civilizing" interconnectedness. But we've taken that interconnectedness far beyond anything REH could possibly have imagined, and created a civilization that is fundamentally antithetical to the entire concept of Conan. If you've grown up with the internet, Conan's just hard to get.

The way REH has continued to influence the world of fantasy fiction has, I think, less to do with the Conan stories themselves then with the history of "weird fiction." I'm kind of surprised nobody's brought up China Miéville or other "New Weird" authors as the descendants of REH. Where Gygax had REH and Jack Vance, I have Tamsyn Muir and Max Gladstone. Conan may be a shadow of his former self, but things are just as Weird up in here as they ever were.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I told the principal that I found it ironic that the school would not make exceptions for book readers while complaining that kids have a reading deficit. I then said “what are you afraid of, he will download more books

Some teachers have an odd attitude to reading, and some have the anti-SF/fantasy prejudice. I had several novels confiscated when I was at school, even though I’m dyslexic, and my partner, an English teacher, has grumbled about her former school’s official reading list (full of difficult to read classics like Treasure Island, Tom Brown’s Schooldays and War of the Worlds) and ban on comics.

But in this case, the reason might be technical - internet connections can be blocked, but it’s much harder to do it selectively.

 

[Dioltach]

My English teacher (pre-university, final year) wouldn't give me credit for reading LotR, because "well, it's a children's book, isn't it?"

 

[Paul Farquhar]

My English teacher (pre-university, final year) wouldn't give me credit for reading LotR, because "well, it's a children's book, isn't it?"

My partner majored in Children’s Literature. So even if that had been true, it doesn’t make it invalid for study.

 

[Dioltach]

My partner majored in Children’s Literature. So even if that had been true, it doesn’t make it invalid for study.

I could have pressed the point - even at 17 I knew about Tolkien and the background to LotR - but I also knew how counterproductive it would be to piss off the person with so much influence on my final grade.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I could have pressed the point - even at 17 I knew about Tolkien and the background to LotR - but I also knew how counterproductive it would be to piss off the person with so much influence on my final grade.

Sure, you just have to roll with it. I expect you read something that is a “classic” but really short and easy like A Christmas Carol or Of Mice and Men.

I expect the real issue was your teacher didn’t want to have to read it in order to mark your essay!

 

[TiQuinn]

Again, teenagers. And Marvel isn't above compromising a character to appeal to a demographic.

That’s incredibly dismissive.

 

[TiQuinn]

View attachment 398969

Ironically most believe this Conan more true to REH'S incarnation but the movie flopped hard.

In fairness, the movie did suck.

 

[Bedrockgames]

I'd argue that the decline of Conan's relevancy is related not just to his age, or the degree to which he is or isn't read, but to the degree that the "barbarian" figure--the figure free from the constraints of civilization, who relies on extreme athleticism, cunning/craftiness, and wild daring to overcome problems soft civilized folk cannot--isn't a very strong heroic fantasy anymore. That's not to say that this figure is entirely gone from pop culture (I mean, isn't Jack Reacher basically Conan?), but the fantasy just doesn't hold the power it used to.

When I was growing up in the 80s, my fantasies of heroism encompassed figures like Robin Hood, Luke Skywalker, D'Artagnan, and Aragorn. As I became a teenager, with a teenager's desire for things that are edgy and bada**, it shifted to include figures like Blade and Sanjuro. On that list, only Sanjuro comes close to being a "barbarian," but he's not really uncivilized, just disreputable. His heroic value isn't that he rejects the skills of civilization for something wild and elemental, but that he's even better at them then reputable samurai. I could understand the appeal of Conan, but he never really spoke to me at all personally. My daughter, on the other hand, just finds him baffling. They can't even see what the appeal is in the first place.

To me, this seems to be to be related to the way the world has changed in the last hundred years. When REH was writing Conan stories, he was reacting against the interconnectedness of the world--already in full swing both politically and technologically--and his fantasy was a rejection of that "civilizing" interconnectedness. But we've taken that interconnectedness far beyond anything REH could possibly have imagined, and created a civilization that is fundamentally antithetical to the entire concept of Conan. If you've grown up with the internet, Conan's just hard to get.

The way REH has continued to influence the world of fantasy fiction has, I think, less to do with the Conan stories themselves then with the history of "weird fiction." I'm kind of surprised nobody's brought up China Miéville or other "New Weird" authors as the descendants of REH. Where Gygax had REH and Jack Vance, I have Tamsyn Muir and Max Gladstone. Conan may be a shadow of his former self, but things are just as Weird up in here as they ever were.

I would argue the figure has more power these days. The more civilized we become and the more complex our society becomes, the more there is that desire to return to a simpler archetype of humanity and masculinity. We live in an age where brawn might seem less relevant (though I think that shows a lot of white collar bias as many jobs still rely on things like strength and athleticism). But we also live in an age where men are trying to look like Conan in greater numbers (just dip into weight lifting and bodybuilding circles, or go to a gym). I am not arguing this is all good. Some of it isn’t. One of my pet peeves at the gym is how common performance enhancing drugs and how abused legitimate treatments are so guys can put on mass. But it is there. I’d argue something like Conan is a much safer way for most guys to connect with this aspect of themselves. It is a vent, a cathartic power fantasy, the way action movies can be. And a I think a lot of men have a desire to tap into that. And there is always that tension between urban and rural which Conan embodies.