WotC Mike Mearls: "D&D Is Uncool Again"

Monster_Manual_Traditional_Cover_Art_copy.webp


In Mike Mearls' recent interview with Ben Riggs, he talks about how he feels that Dungeons & Dragons has had its moment, and is now uncool again. Mearls was one of the lead designers of D&D 5E and became the franchise's Creative Director in 2018. He worked at WotC until he was laid off in 2023. He is now EP of roleplaying games at Chaosium, the publisher of Call of Chulhu.

My theory is that when you look back at the OGL, the real impact of it is that it made D&D uncool again. D&D was cool, right? You had Joe Manganiello and people like that openly talking about playing D&D. D&D was something that was interesting, creative, fun, and different. And I think what the OGL did was take that concept—that Wizards and this idea of creativity that is inherent in the D&D brand because it's a roleplaying game, and I think those two things were sundered. And I don’t know if you can ever put them back together.

I think, essentially, it’s like that phrase: The Mandate of Heaven. I think fundamentally what happened was that Wizards has lost the Mandate of Heaven—and I don’t see them even trying to get it back.

What I find fascinating is that it was Charlie Hall who wrote that article. This is the same Charlie Hall who wrote glowing reviews of the 5.5 rulebooks. And then, at the same time, he’s now writing, "This is your chance because D&D seems to be stumbling." How do you square that? How do I go out and say, "Here are the two new Star Wars movies. They’re the best, the most amazing, the greatest Star Wars movies ever made. By the way, Star Wars has never been weaker. Now is the time for other sci-fi properties", like, to me that doesn’t make any sense! To me, it’s a context thing again.

Maybe this is the best Player’s Handbook ever written—but the vibes, the audience, the people playing these games—they don’t seem excited about it. We’re not seeing a groundswell of support and excitement. Where are the third-party products? That’s what I'd ask. Because that's what you’d think, "oh, there’s a gap", I mean remember before the OGL even came up, back when 3.0 launched, White Wolf had a monster book. There were multiple adventures at Gen Con. The license wasn’t even official yet, and there were already adventures showing up in stores. We're not seeing that, what’s ostensibly the new standard going forward? If anything, we’re seeing the opposite—creators are running in the opposite direction. I mean, that’s where I’m going.

And hey—to plug my Patreon—patreon.com/mikemearls (one word). This time last year, when I was looking at my post-Wizards options, I thought, "Well, maybe I could start doing 5E-compatible stuff." And now what I’m finding is…I just don’t want to. Like—it just seems boring. It’s like trying to start a hair metal band in 1992. Like—No, no, no. Everyone’s mopey and we're wearing flannel. It's Seattle and rain. It’s Nirvana now, man. It’s not like Poison. And that’s the vibe I get right now, yeah, Poison was still releasing albums in the ’90s. They were still selling hundreds of thousands or a million copies. But they didn’t have any of the energy. It's moved on. But what’s interesting to me is that roleplaying game culture is still there. And that’s what I find fascinating about gaming in general—especially TTRPGs. I don’t think we’ve ever had a period where TTRPGs were flourishing, and had a lot of energy and excitement around them, and D&D wasn’t on the upswing. Because I do think that’s what’s happening now. We’re in very strange waters where I think D&D is now uncool.
 

log in or register to remove this ad


log in or register to remove this ad

The definition of what a book is has changed over the past couple of decades and now includes digital even if your personal definition differs.
WotC intentionally differentiated between book and product, so they too drew a distinction there, whatever it is.

Does the NYT bestseller list (or any other) include ebooks? Do you consider an audiobook a book sale? What about a movie adaptation?
 

WotC intentionally differentiated between book and product, so they too drew a distinction there, whatever it is.

Does the NYT bestseller list (or any other) include ebooks? Do you consider an audiobook a book sale? What about a movie adaptation?

You have access to dictionary.com. Look up book. The second definition includes e-books. As far as I'm concerned hardcover, paperback, digital and audio books are just different formats of a book. Do you have any documentation to back up your assertion other than just your say-so that WOTC doesn't count digital copies of the PHB as a book?
 

Mearles has an account here....has anyone...you know....asked him to clarify?
I figure if he wanted to clarify his statement he could. He’s been on the board several times and has participated at length in discussions. But I’m also not a reporter seeking clarification on a comment for the record.
 

I figure if he wanted to clarify his statement he could. He’s been on the board several times and has participated at length in discussions. But I’m also not a reporter seeking clarification on a comment for the record.
In that case; can you direct me to a place where I can argue with people over vague nonspecific third party statements? 😉
 

You have access to dictionary.com. Look up book. The second definition includes e-books.
that doesn’t tell us anything about whether WotC does

Do you have any documentation to back up your assertion other than just your say-so that WOTC doesn't count digital copies of the PHB as a book?
other than them specifically saying product rather than book and them being very intentional in their wording no. To me that is still more than for the case that they include them, as that does not account for intentionality.

I am playing the odds here because WotC is generally not forthcoming with clear information so they can put the best spin on things. You seem to play against the odds just because there is a chance for the other outcome

Also there are the inconveniently (for you) lower analog sales of 2024 vs 2023. Let me know if you have anything to support your ‘conclusion’ or whether all you have is (justified) uncertainty of mine, because if it is the latter we at best disagree about probabilities and this will go nowhere
 

You're neglecting they always use somewhat vague terms and rarely provide solid numbers.
Of course they don't provide numbers; that's standard behavior. Businesses generally don't provide numbers to the public unless they're legally required to do so.

But that doesn't mean that what they said is unclear. "Fastest-selling" and "best-selling" are obvious, if nonspecific. Did they sell 1% more of the 2024 PHB within a certain time period than of prior products? 50% more? We don't know, but what they said is they sold more.

Nonspecificity does not justify saying that "more" could actually mean "less", though, which is some people are trying to argue, or at least create doubt about.

AKA spin. They're not directly lying but they're being very disingenuous with the truth.
So apparently we agree that the 2024 PHB, at the time statement was made, was the "fastest-selling D&D product in history". I think we disagree on who's being disingenuous with that truth, though.
 


that doesn’t tell us anything about whether WotC does


other than them specifically saying product rather than book and them being very intentional in their wording no. To me that is still more than for the case that they include them, as that does not account for intentionality.

I am playing the odds here because WotC is generally not forthcoming with clear information so they can put the best spin on things. You seem to play against the odds just because there is a chance for the other outcome

Also there are the inconveniently (for you) lower analog sales of 2024 vs 2023. Let me know if you have anything to support your ‘conclusion’ or whether all you have is (justified) uncertainty of mine, because if it is the latter we at best disagree about probabilities and this will go nowhere
I'm still unclear what the point of your argument is... so ill ask again...what exactly do you feel WotC was being misleading about? The sales of '24 rulebooks that took place? Because whether digital or physical and whether by multiple people or one person... a sale of the PHB was a sale... correct?
 

But that doesn't mean that what they said is unclear. "Fastest-selling" and "best-selling" are obvious, if nonspecific. Did they sell 1% more of the 2024 PHB within a certain time period than of prior products? 50% more? We don't know, but what they said is they sold more.

Nonspecificity does not justify saying that "more" could actually mean "less", though, which is some people are trying to argue, or at least create doubt about.
no, I agree that it is the fastest / best selling ‘something’, the disagreement is not about whether fastest can be interpreted as best but whether ‘product’ means ‘book’ or also means best selling book in addition to best selling product.
 

Remove ads

Remove ads

Top