GOD RULES: Player's Guide (5e) Kickstarter Pre-Launch Page

[Upper_Krust]

Raditz can more or less tank moon-buster shots, and no sell said moon-busters.

...looking into it a bit more...

Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon - which killed Raditz was (at that point) akin to a low yield nuke. Splitting the difference (between 1 KT and 1 MT) lets say 30 Kilotons = 735 damage by my rules.

He is hypersonic (or superluminal if you go by certain dubs, but that's a stretch) and is considered a supreme weakling in his setting.

I have rules for that in the book. If he was Hypersonic he would be constantly under the mechanical benefits of a double haste (on top of the movement speed increase).

Even then however, I cannot give him a bigger number than yours since he has no resistance to mind effects or spells in general(and 5e has no infinitely scaling 'saves' due to sheer HD) so... yeah. That's a universal argument against most DBZ characters.

My revised estimate would be to put Raditz close to CR 24/Divine Rank 3. With Goku and Piccolo (at that time) in around CR 16-20 Divine Ranks 1-2.

The Special Beam Cannon can potentially double its power every round it is 'powered up' to a potential maximum of x3, lets say.

 

[Upper_Krust]

@Upper_Krust , does your bestiary have sizes above Gargantuan/below Tiny?

Yes. I detailed these in the Player's Guide (even though its more apropos for the Bestiary). Just to clarify these are vastly simplified from my 3.5E sizes and are deliberately vague on the exact number of feet. For instance a creature might be 'Mountainous' = Mountain-sized, or 'Galactic' = Galaxy-sized etc. Nitpicking at these extreme sizes will only just slow down the game.

Plus this new system has a scaling method for going up and down 'dimensions' - so moving up or down dimensions scales characters up by 4 size categories. However, creatures moving up dimensions are 'upscaled' - so if you are Medium size you will stay that size in the 4th, 5th, 6th dimensions etc.

So a Monster that is Huge in the 5th dimension will be City-sized in the 4th dimension and Moon-sized in the 3rd dimension.

So a party fighting a Huge 5D monster in the 5th dimension will all be upscaled to 5D Medium-size themselves. But fight the same monster in the Known Planes (3D Space) and it will be the size of the Moon.

Depending upon which side a Planar Gate/Rift was opened, those going through might have their size change or stay the same - so if the GM wants to drop Adventurers in the 4th dimension but have the (Medium-size) natives be Colossal Size they can do that. If you want 5D characters (such as Darkseid to use a parallel example) to Boom tube down to 3D space and just be Medium-size you can do that to.

If so, how far does it go?

All the way.

Omniversal.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Yes, I am sure there is over Gargantuan, what I am less sure is smaller than Tiny. However, given his previous work I am guessing yes, but he may not see the need.

No need to go smaller than tiny because of the Sliding Scale of my new system.

Just change from metres to millimetres to have 'Huge' size Giga-Fleas. Or go from metres to micrometers to fight Blood Cells. Drop down further and battle DNAngels, Virus Hydras and so forth.

I'll have all that mapped out in the Bestiary - not enough space to explain it in the Player's Guide though.

 

[AnotherGuy]

Plus this new system has a scaling method for going up and down 'dimensions' - so moving up or down dimensions scales characters up by 4 size categories. However, creatures moving up dimensions are 'upscaled' - so if you are Medium size you will stay that size in the 4th, 5th, 6th dimensions etc.

So a Monster that is Huge in the 5th dimension will be City-sized in the 4th dimension and Moon-sized in the 3rd dimension.

So a party fighting a Huge 5D monster in the 5th dimension will all be upscaled to 5D Medium-size themselves. But fight the same monster in the Known Planes (3D Space) and it will be the size of the Moon.

Depending upon which side a Planar Gate/Rift was opened, those going through might have their size change or stay the same - so if the GM wants to drop Adventurers in the 4th dimension but have the (Medium-size) natives be Colossal Size they can do that. If you want 5D characters (such as Darkseid to use a parallel example) to Boom tube down to 3D space and just be Medium-size you can do that to.

Omniversal.

As a Mystara-fan you're speaking my love RPG language!

 

[John98GR]

...looking into it a bit more...

Piccolo's Special Beam Cannon - which killed Raditz was (at that point) akin to a low yield nuke. Splitting the difference (between 1 KT and 1 MT) lets say 30 Kilotons = 735 damage by my rules.

We can argue what Piccolo's Beam was at that point, but the hard fact is 2 episodes later he blasted the moon as a Standard Action.
If he blasted the Moon without batting an eye then his Moon Buster at that point was weaker than his Special Beam Cannon, which required ~50 rounds (5 minutes ×10 rounds each).
Raditz receives a normal, "standard action" blast from Piccolo on their first meeting and was unscathed.
"It didn't look like a big deal" is also a universal DBZ argument. You see attacks that are constantly woefully unimpressive for their weight categories. Japanese writers sadly have no sense of scale.

 

[dave2008]

Glad to hear it, I was doing the same thing, though a little different in the specifics. Your system seems slightly more abstract than what I was working on, but that was where I was hoping to get. Yet another reason I made the correct decision to build off the broad shoulders of UK!

 

[Upper_Krust]

We can argue what Piccolo's Beam was at that point,

In Versus debates there is a term called "Space Cheese" that often applies in these situations.

I just watched the whole fight, we can clearly see the effect of the Special Beam Cannon on a mountaintop - its clearly (at best) low Kiloton Range and no better than that.

but the hard fact is 2 episodes later he blasted the moon as a Standard Action.

Here is a high-rated quote from the Comments under the Piccolo destroys the moon clip:

"Well I think one time the moon was projected and not real it was from the space pod Goku came from! Its been awhile since I saw the show though"

If he blasted the Moon without batting an eye then his Moon Buster at that point was weaker than his Special Beam Cannon, which required ~50 rounds (5 minutes ×10 rounds each).

See above comment and note there are multiple different posters and comments saying it was not the real Moon.

Raditz receives a normal, "standard action" blast from Piccolo on their first meeting and was unscathed.
"It didn't look like a big deal" is also a universal DBZ argument. You see attacks that are constantly woefully unimpressive for their weight categories.

I would estimate Piccolo's Standard Action (Ranged Attack) Special Beam Cannon at that time was dealing around 40d10 damage. With the triple-powered beamed up version clocking in at 120d10. He'd need to be doing close to ten times that amount of damage to one-shot the Moon (in my system).

Japanese writers sadly have no sense of scale.

That's when I step in and make sense of it all.

There are high showings, low showings and somewhere in between typically lies the truth.

 

[Upper_Krust]

As a Mystara-fan you're speaking my love RPG language!

I think I mentioned it before, but I have a few nods to Mystara in the book - one of which is (IMO) awesome and answers what happened to those Hierarchs who gave up their immortal power and then made it back to Hierarch status only to be swarmed by Blackballs...and vanish?

Could also show the super-cool art I had commissioned (by a Death Metal Album cover artist) of what they look like now - but that might have to wait.

 

[John98GR]

Here is a high-rated quote from the Comments under the Piccolo destroys the moon clip:

"Well I think one time the moon was projected and not real it was from the space pod Goku came from! Its been awhile since I saw the show though"

Vegeta clearly didn't find the Moon and needed to use a technique to transform to an Oozaru.
I am terribly sorry for all the people out there that want to say otherwise, but Piccolo blasted the Moon. It was not a metaphorical Moon, it was not an illusionary Moon, it was the actual Moon. If it was otherwise, Vegeta would not need a Power Ball to go Oozaru.

Side-note: It was never stated in the original series that it was ever an illusion. A video game retconning this decades after the fact is another matter entirely. If you want to argue that, then I will back away. Do not expect me to take this statement seriously however when Roshi of all people can blow up the Moon in the Pre-Z era, but Piccolo somehow "cannot". It is the same retcon as the potara earrings not being 'permanent'. Before Super, all games and material by default considered the potara fusion permanent. If it was some sort of secret "lore", then I believe official games would do something about it.

I just watched the whole fight, we can clearly see the effect of the Special Beam Cannon on a mountaintop - its clearly (at best) low Kiloton Range and no better than that.

There is no narrative, authoritative, or even logical reason to state that Piccolo's most powerful attack at the time somehow has less power output than Master Roshi's Kamehameha in the original Dragon Ball series, which he intended to use it to kill Goku. We cannot argue in good faith and somehow pretend that Roshi had the potential to dish-out moves that are stronger than early DBZ. If that was the case, he would not need the Evil Containment Wave against King Piccolo (the older guy in original DB), and they should have asked him instead to kill Raditz.

 

[Alzrius]

Vegeta clearly didn't find the Moon and needed to use a technique to transform to an Oozaru.
I am terribly sorry for all the people out there that want to say otherwise, but Piccolo blasted the Moon. It was not a metaphorical Moon, it was not an illusionary Moon, it was the actual Moon. If it was otherwise, Vegeta would not need a Power Ball to go Oozaru.

It's been a long time since I've watched DBZ, but I believe that the moon was actually destroyed by Master Roshi during the Tenkaichi Budokai (the first one that we see in the original Dragonball manga). The issue with Piccolo "destroying" it was, if I recall correctly, from a filler episode of the anime (where, I believe, it is supposedly a projection from the space capsule that originally brought Goku to that planet) and not in the actual manga.

EDIT: Pulling my old copies of the Japanese manga off the shelf...no, it looks like Piccolo actually did destroy the moon also.