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D&D (2024) why are spell schools and what should they be?

RealAlHazred

RealAlHazred

Frumious Flumph (Your Grace/Your Eminence)
Mind of tempest said:
why make a class for a sub class when you could just make the sub class better you want an endless army of wizards clone classes?
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I wanted "subclasses" with actual different powers. So a generalist wizard would be the vanilla option -- she gets all of the possible spells to select from, but she has no special powers. Then, illusionists get some special "illusionist power," like in 5E they can use the 0-level minor illusion more effectively. They have some limitations, but in exchange get special abilities. Maybe necromancers can rebuke undead to command them, using the paladin turning chart, or some such. Different minor-but-generally-useful abilities in exchange for their limitations in spell schools.
 

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Undrave

Undrave

Legend
Mephista said:

Undrave -​

Okay, if you don't find it intuitive.... What would you find that's both intuitive AND useful in play? Because if its just flavor texting and nothing to back it up, there's no point to it and will be ignored more than schools are now.
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I feel like the easiest way there would be a in-universe classification is what they can DO for the Wizard. If I'm a Wizard and another guy asks me if I got spell scrolls for sale and he's not particular about which spell, I'd ask "What do you want to do?". Do you want to inflict damage? Heal a body? Enhance a body? Manipulate Matter? Place a curse on someone? Conjure up a being? Manipulate time? A lot of these questions would direct how I file my spells. They would probably not relate to the specific magical process or game mechanic but rather what it's used for.

Mephista said:
And, hey, its very scholarly arcane-like, but again... Detect Magic.
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If Detect Magic can tell you the school of a spell, that would mean there is a fundamental quality to spells of the Abjuration School that is different from spells from the Evocation or Illusion school. Something that can be determined by any Wizard regardless of cultural origin. That implies a certain scientific hard magic system hidden behind the game that's not particularly well developed.

In 4e, Detect Magic was just rolled up in the Arcana skill, where you could just KNOW the magic or not.
 

Mind of tempest

Mind of tempest

(he/him)advocate for 5e psionics
Vaalingrade said:
Because Summoner should not be a subclass at all!

Or a Wizard!
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okay so then why is it not a wizard?
should there be no wizard?
RealAlHazred said:
I wanted "subclasses" with actual different powers. So a generalist wizard would be the vanilla option -- she gets all of the possible spells to select from, but she has no special powers. Then, illusionists get some special "illusionist power," like in 5E they can use the 0-level minor illusion more effectively. They have some limitations, but in exchange get special abilities. Maybe necromancers can rebuke undead to command them, using the paladin turning chart, or some such. Different minor-but-generally-useful abilities in exchange for their limitations in spell schools.
Click to expand...
the problem is a generalist always ends up better than a specialist when it comes to games and it makes for a poor class.

but otherwise, I get your point.
Cadence said:
If the fourth Dying Earth book taught me anything (besides that it really doesn't fit with the first three) it's that all the wizards are summoners.
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it has real-world backing but I forget where as my mind is scattered on a good day.
 

Cadence

Cadence

Legend
Supporter
Mind of tempest said:
it has real-world backing but I forget where as my mind is scattered on a good day.
Click to expand...
I'm curious what you mean by real-world backing.

But I'm also hungry (and apparently easily suggestible).

1671134673546.png
 



Mind of tempest

Mind of tempest

(he/him)advocate for 5e psionics
Cadence said:
I'm this close to googling it... but I'm even more tempted to prod you until you break down and do it for me :)
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if you can figure out how to look at past amazon orders I could get the book's name for you as I am not phoning a man up at this time of night to ask if summoning spirits is how some magic works.
 


Cadence

Cadence

Legend
Supporter
Vaalingrade said:
Dying Earth is how we got in this mess in he first place!
Click to expand...
It doesn't feel like Dying Earth gave us a system as complicated as electron orbits... And it would have also gotten them all kinds of other cool things if they embraced the rest of the things wizards do?
 

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