D&D (2024) It Is 2025 And Save Or Suck Spells Still Suck (the fun out of the game)

If the bolded is literally what the Wizard said then by the rules the half dragon should have left, but as soon as he left he would have completed the task, ending the spell and breaking the charmed condition. So he should have gotten out the door and then turned around.
No, that is not "literally" what he said. He literally said what is written in the spell description, except "cave" instead of "library."
The Dragon should have swooped down and breathed on the Wizard to kill his concentration on suggestion.
Games have rules. The dragon could not reach the wizard and breathe that round.
 

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Regarding the "forced movement" discussion, I don't think there is anything in the rules about that.

Being moved (pushed, gust of wind, Thunderwave etc) does not cause an AOO, moving (as in using your own movement does). I think the rules are pretty clear on this.

I think where forced movement comes up is the 2014 Booming Blade Cantrip and "willingly moves", I don't know of anything else that aribitrates on whether the movement is willing or unwilling/forced.
 

Are they in 2024? In 2014 the creature is just grappled. A grappled creature isn't restrained--at least I don't think so--even in 2024. But I could be wrong as I don't have the books myself.

You are correct. A grappled creature has disadvantage to attack a creature other than the grappler, but there are no bonuses or penalties to being attacked unless the grappler has the Grappler feat, in which case they do have advantage (but not anyone else).
 

You are correct. A grappled creature has disadvantage to attack a creature other than the grappler, but there are no bonuses or penalties to being attacked unless the grappler has the Grappler feat, in which case they do have advantage (but not anyone else).
Good. Nice to know some things weren't changed to make them super easy/powerful in 2024. :)
 

Regarding the "forced movement" discussion, I don't think there is anything in the rules about that.

Being moved (pushed, gust of wind, Thunderwave etc) does not cause an AOO, moving (as in using your own movement does). I think the rules are pretty clear on this.

I think where forced movement comes up is the 2014 Booming Blade Cantrip and "willingly moves", I don't know of anything else that aribitrates on whether the movement is willing or unwilling/forced.
Here is what the 2024/5.2 SRD says:
"Opportunity Attacks
You can make an Opportunity Attack when a creature
that you can see leaves your reach using its
action, its Bonus Action, its Reaction, or one of its
speeds. To make the Opportunity Attack, take a Reaction
to make one melee attack with a weapon or
an Unarmed Strike against the provoking creature.
The attack occurs right before the creature leaves
your reach."


Since Dissonant Whispers requires the creature to move using its own speed, it seems to qualify. If you pushed or pulled an enmy with eldricht blast or thorn whip, it would not qualify.
 

We just started looking at Daggerheart via the SRD. Oddly enough, it has many things my DM's homebrew uses, but also obviously includes a lot of stuff his doesn't!

It's frustrating. Everything we look at has "this is cool, or that is great" but also "man, we would never do that this way! or sorry, but that is really stupid". I'm sort of excited if WW does a Dark Ages game renewal. We'll see.

I swear, if we could make a game that was:

20% AD&D
15% DND 3E
15% DND 5E
15% Five Torches Deep
10% Shadowdark
10% Nimble
10% d20 Star Wars (Revised)
5% Miscellaneous like Ironsworn, Daggerheart, B/X, etc.

Roll it all up in a low-magic, gritty, medieval fantasy setting and we'd have our perfect game...
So, Dragonbane?

One way to make the encounter a bit less of a saving throw crap shoot is the assume the Dragon has spent some time on defenses. Even a few Magic Mouth spells setup as an alarm system will prevent the Dragon from being behind the initiative curve when the encounter starts. If the Dragon, or other opponent, can't cast, maybe it traded a bit of loot for some casing services. Or even making a deal with some local Dwarves or similar for some doors between the lair and the dungeon at large. Or traps. The traps don't even have to be damaging, just noisy.
Again, Rule Zero saves the day here. In a world where a Suggestion spell can make your driver go truffle hunting for eight hours straight, leaving you stranded in your finest silks (?), it's pretty reasonable to have a Dispel Magic trap placed here and there. Which doesn't have to be in the DM's notes to "exist."
 

Again, Rule Zero saves the day here. In a world where a Suggestion spell can make your driver go truffle hunting for eight hours straight, leaving you stranded in your finest silks (?), it's pretty reasonable to have a Dispel Magic trap placed here and there. Which doesn't have to be in the DM's notes to "exist."
I generally don't use "Rule Zero" as a tool to undermine the players or compensate for bad die rolls or -- if we are playing RAW with intent -- to fix rules that kind of suck. It is effectively cheating and I don't like it.
 

Uggg as a DM your hands are tied by these spells. The best tactical option for the enemies may be to cast suggestion and take a PC out of the fight,
Yes. What's good for the goose...
but no one wants to make a player sit for an hour and do nothing.
If you're playing your NPCs true to character this simply should not be an issue, and ideally the players have been well warned about this ahead of time.
 

Uggg as a DM your hands are tied by these spells. The best tactical option for the enemies may be to cast suggestion and take a PC out of the fight, but no one wants to make a player sit for an hour and do nothing.

Yes. What's good for the goose...

If you're playing your NPCs true to character this simply should not be an issue, and ideally the players have been well warned about this ahead of time.

I have never understood the idea of wanting to start a arms race with the players.
 


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