D&D 3E/3.5 3.5 improved familiar rules

[essidus]

Basically, I have a player who wants to use the improved familiar feat to get a Runic Guardian(mm2, P. 182) as his familiar. I've looked over every rulebook for all the scraps of info I could find, and I'm left puzzled. It suggests Level, size category, and even base attack bonus requirements, but doesn't ever seem to give any details about what those requirements are. Also, it seems like the rules between Complete Warrior and the DMG on improved familiars are in conflict. Can anyone please clarify this for me, and explain which book would be considered the source to follow?

 

[Jack Simth]

When in doubt, check the CR, and compare to other critters available as familiars with Improved Familiar. A Runic Gaurdian is CR 10. A Shocker Lizard (CR 2) is available at 5th; the highest CR critter on the Improved Familiar list in the DMG is the Ice Memphit, at CR 3, available at 7th. If every +2 levels get you +1 CR on an Improved familiar, using the Shocker Lizard (CR 2, 5th), as a base, then the Runic Gaurdian wouldn't be available as a familiar until... 21st level (+8 CR over the Shocker Lizard, so +16 levels) ... and the Ice Memphit and Shocker Lizard are the highest CR of the Improved Familiars for their level availability.

AKA "no"

Edit:
Checking the thing out, though, there's hardly any point in adding familiar bonuses - what with the DR, fast healing, lots of HP, reasonable AC, and so on.

 

[Stormborn]

I am all for giving players what they want to be happy, but I agree with Jack's assessment that a Runic Guardian would be an epic level familiar. Might I suggest instead a smaller construct? MMV has a Gem Scarab as an option, for example. Or some of the Artificer companion constructs in the Eberron Campaign Setting might work as well.

 

[aboyd]

Also, it seems like the rules between Complete Warrior and the DMG on improved familiars are in conflict.

The source to follow is the source you deem to be the one to follow.

For example, the Rules Compendium came out at the end of the 3.5 run, and supposedly corrects/compiles all rules into one "final say" document. It should be the document that wins out over others. However, as DM I've stated that it simply doesn't exist in my game, so we must deal with the rules as-is in all the other books.

So if you deem the DMG to be the final say, then it is.

Having said that, my general practice is that of the books I allow the most recent ones win. So the Magic Item Compendium, which revises a lot of magic items from the Complete series of books, takes precedence over the Complete books themselves.

In your case, Complete Warrior is more recent than the DMG, and so the rule refinements in CW might be better playtested, and therefore more viable.

As for where to place a particular familiar on the range of available options, I'd mostly just place it along the CR axis.

 

[FEADIN]

From the SRD:

Improved Familiar [General]

".....The list in Table: Improved Familiar by Alignment presents only a few possible improved familiars. Almost any creature of the same general size and power as those on the list makes a suitable familiar."

I don't think the Runic Guardian is even close with the last sentence...

 

[green slime]

Is it fair for everyone at the table? Is it fun? Is it just blatant power gaming?

Seriously, these problems can be resolved by open and honest dialogue. At the gaming table.

 

[lordxaviar]

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what the hell did i post?