3.5 or d20 Modern?

Christopher Lambert said:
A thread got locked describing these products here. Some poor GM bought the product for D20 Modenr on the assumption that they could play a game with them, and apparently he could not.

I really don't see how mentioning these products on this board could get a thread locked, and having just reviewed the rules of this board to make sure, I'm going to mention them if they seem relevant until a moderator says not to.

However, I do have a copy of the Pocket Modern Handbook and it is perfectly usable to play with, it's not fancy by any stretch of the imagination, and it's definitely not suitable as someone's first RPG. It is exactly what it claims to be, a pocket version of the book, which means it's abridged and condensed, and if I was going to run it I would have a copy of the full rulebook lying around, and see the Pocket books as books for players to have for their own reference (and having more books to look things up with around the table) or for in the Modern case, someone who was already familiar with the basics of d20 who wanted to incorporate things from d20 Modern into another d20 game but not run an entire d20M game.

For the original posters idea of upgrading from 3.0 to either 3.5 or d20M, either way I'd say get the main book from WotC, but point out the Pocket books for players (especially experienced ones) who would like to have their own reference but be able to save a little money in the process.
 

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I might go with the D20 Modern Book or Grim Tales (which does rock). I would strongly suggest CMGs Inexpensive and well laid out SRD Bundle which includes the updated psionics rules and all things 3.5 you might need for your game. You can find anything in there quickly and print/cut and paste as necessary. Really quite nice for laptop DMs such as myself or anyone wanting a quick and complete electronic reference.
 

I can't reccomend d20 Modern highly enough. IMO, it's an improvement on 3.0 D&D in essentially every way, and in many ways superior to 3.5 as well.

First, d20 Modern dispenses with the Your Class Is Who You Are mode of D&D, which is a massive benefit in my book. The next time I hear a player ask me why my "thief" can't pick locks and doesn't want to steal from the party will be too soon; in d20 Modern, you are who you want to be, unfettered by class archtypes that were cool two decades ago but look a little long in the tooth after the hundreth session of D&D.

Second, d20 Modern cuts down to size the massively cumbersome magic system of standard d20. It doesn't require magic at all (and certainly has no 'wealth by level guidelines' or golfbags of magic weapons), and if you do introduce magic, you can do so at a much reduced and more playable scale. Personally, I like to use Arcana Unearthed's more flavorful (and versatile) spells with the level caps and entry requirements of d20 Modern; your mileage may vary.

Third, d20 Modern dispenses with the wealth-by-level guidelines, and, indeed, with the items-as-power mentality of core D&D. Level, skills and feats matter; equipment does, too, but you're more likely to procure it at need rather than amass great mounds of treasure. I already mentioned this, but it bears repeating.

Fourth, d20 Modern is a (cut-down) all-in-one book. One stop shopping for all your GMing needs, provided you're a skilled homebrewer. True, you can get the whole SRD printed out for free, but a book is much more convenient.

Fifth, d20 Modern makes a nice compromise between 3.0 and 3.5 when it comes to critical hits. Crit enhancers stack (as in 3.0), but they only add 1 regardless of the initial traits of the weapon. This keeps crit-stacking under control but seems more fun and flavorful than 3.5's gutting of it.

Now, d20 Modern vs. Grim Tales... I'm one of the very few on ENWorld to prefer the former to the latter. Both are much superior to D&D 3.x, IMO, but I like d20 Modern's system better. I like advanced and prestige classes, which d20 Modern retains and Grim Tales dumps. Mongoose has released some interesting d20 Modern-ish games in its OGL line: their Steampunk volume is particularly nice. Spycraft is a system I haven't had the chance to play, but it does look very elegant at a glance, and perhaps worth a look. I'd get only one of these; there's just too much overlap between them.

If you want more fantasy and less modern, I'd also suggest Mongoose's Conan the RPG; there's a sword and sorcery system different enough to get players' blood pumping! Very good product. Even if you just want to play a more standard fantasy game, its magic system, classes and suggested GMing style are all a step up from D&D, and it, like d20 Modern or Grim Tales, is a single, self-contained volume. Unlike either d20 Modern or Grim Tales, it has received extensive support from its company of origin, should you want further material.
 

MoogleEmpMog said:
The next time I hear a player ask me why my "thief" can't pick locks and doesn't want to steal from the party will be too soon.

LOL! I hear you on that one. But I've also run into groups where can use a different game system and you still get sideways glances the moment you get a "lock picking" or "Stealth" skill.

MoogleEmpMog said:
Second, d20 Modern cuts down to size the massively cumbersome magic system of standard d20. It doesn't require magic at all (and certainly has no 'wealth by level guidelines' or golfbags of magic weapons), and if you do introduce magic, you can do so at a much reduced and more playable scale. Personally, I like to use Arcana Unearthed's more flavorful (and versatile) spells with the level caps and entry requirements of d20 Modern; your mileage may vary.

I'm not a big fan of spell slots, but in the other way. I want the flexibilty to go from low-magic up to Akira-style powers and not neccessarly have the all the extra bonuses (or lack there of) that go with "levels" needed to get access to those types of FX.
 
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I will also pile in for Grim Tales. It actually updates D20 Modern with some 3.5 conventions and fantasy elements (it can be set in any era), and has chase rules building on the ones in Spycraft, so it seems the perfect fit for what you are looking for. You can use the SRD for spells, monsters, etc

Of course 3.0, 3.5, and D20 Modern are all good (OD&D not so sure)
 

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