3.X Zombies: How Can They Be More Of a Threat?

[Wik]

You know, in a game I ran about two years ago, the PCs were around 3rd level and approaching a "city of the dead". I think it was actually known as the "city of the flesh eaters".

Anyways, it was a cold rain, and they knew something bad was on it's way. That night, the party of five made camp, and put two people on guard while everyone else hunkered down inside their tents.

A group of eight zombies approached the group through the underbrush, making a fair amount of noise. Each round, I had the watch roll listen checks - and two watchmen failed DC 8 listen checks. Three rounds in a row.

The zombies SURPRISED the group, got in a surprise round, and overwhelmed one of the guards, forcing him to the ground. The group put up a very close fight, and everyone was on the edge of their seats. Crossbow bolts were just being swallowed up by zombie flesh. The warmage's blasts were only hitting one at a time, and they were so close that he couldn't use his area effect attacks. And they just kept pressing in...

The moral of this story? If the zombies get the surprise on the group (and how many zombie movies do we see where this happens? I think all of them), the encounter can get much tougher. Now, if you have high level groups, zombies aren't going to be much of a threat - that's kind of how the game is supposed to work. But, using RAW, zombies can still be pretty tough.

Also, remember that in most zombie movies, it's pretty easy to fight zombies, until they outnumber you or get the jump on you. And that is perfectly mimicked in D&D - even 5th level characters will have to fight hard against zombies if they get close and attack in waves.

 

[Li Shenron]

If you want those silly things that pass of as zombies in modern movies use ghouls.

Imo the D&D zombies are fine (might be still a bit harder to kill) . The modern movie "zombies" are completely laughable.

I agree.

I'm positive about adding a disease-like ability, or even the ability to create spawn. Not at all about making them fast. A fast zombie is an oxymoron for me.

 

[Cthulhudrew]

The surprise angle is not a bad one, and you're right- it does fit with the zombie movie trope. Maybe give them a special Move Silently skill (since zombies don't generally have skills) that can be used to oppose Listen checks for determining surprise.

 

[Angel Tarragon]

Green Ronin's Advanced Bestiary has stats for a "dread zombie" template. .

There is also a chapter in the back on Variant Undead; offering 2 'quickplates' for Zombies; the Greater Zombie (any amount of HD, limited to the base creature's HD) and the Hardened Zombie (AC+1, DR 5/-).

I aloso think that making zombies plague bearer's is a great idea. Imagine one person that survives an encounter with zombies , with minimal damage but now now carries a disease. Wouldn't be too much of a stretch for the plague to spread to the rest of a town relatively quick. It could turn into an epidemic real quick.

Also, the ravenous template (Advanced Bestiary, pg 211) might make a good addition to the zombie.

 

[Rechan]

I aloso think that making zombies plague bearer's is a great idea. Imagine one person that survives an encounter with zombies , with minimal damage but now now carries a disease. Wouldn't be too much of a stretch for the plague to spread to the rest of a town relatively quick. It could turn into an epidemic real quick.

(Tangent)

Once had an NPC Necromancer working for some plague priests. He used zombie animals (snakes, mice) to move through the market, spreading disease on the food in the stands.

 

[Will]

If you want higher CR zombies, I highly suggest doing something other than adding undead HD. Undead HD suck terribly.

My vote is give them fighter levels, and let them select monster feats (natural weapon, natural attack, etc.) as fighter feats.

I also like the ghoul idea, combined with the same.

(Note: Ghouls with cleric levels... are freakin' scary)

 

[greatamericanfolkher]

If I remember correctly one of the corpse crafter feats in LM made undead explode when they hit 0 hp in a negative energy burst that would harm the living and heal other undead around them. That would be pretty nasty if used en masse.

 

[Presto2112]

So many wonderful ideas and suggestions! I'm going to have to take some or all of these into account on the next "holy" night of Nerull rolls around in my campaign world...

 

[shilsen]

If you're trying to pull off the swarming aspect without using the mob template, just give zombies something like an untyped +1 to hit, damage and grapple checks for every additional zombie threatening the target. That can get very ugly very fast for people who are surrounded.

 

[Will]

Another possibility occurs to me... make 3/4 of the zombies 'aid another' the remaining quarter, particularly if the party's AC is otherwise too high.

Sure, it sounds weird, but consider the 'helpful' aspect of grabbing at the character.