D&D 3E/3.5 3e -> 4e: Have we lost options?

[mcrow]

There may be a few less options but on the whole I think it is very similar in total number of options, comparing core books.

It think that building a character in 4E now is less focused on feats and more focused on class abilites and powers and that may give people the impression that there are less options. There seems to be less options that are open to multiple class/races but within the classes/races there are more options.

 

[Felon]

Does that mean it isn't possible, just because they don't translate directly to a paragon path?

My bottom line is this: the game is a splatbook or two away from being accessible to me. I want the smart/fast rogue be viable. I want non-spellcasters to get something for investing in INT.

And just because there's a handful of concepts you can't translate doesn't mean there isn't breadth in the system, and also doesn't mean that it won't be fun to play. Just think up a different concept

If I'm weighting one edition against the other, then the suggestion that I ought to abandon a favorite concept to play 4e definitely earns a demerit.

 

[Lord Sessadore]

My bottom line is this: the game is a splatbook or two away from being accessible to me. I want the smart/fast rogue be viable. I want non-spellcasters to get something for investing in INT.

If I'm weighting one edition against the other, then the suggestion that I ought to abandon a favorite concept to play 4e definitely earns a demerit.

Ok, came across wrong. I didn't mean that you should ditch your favorite idea just to play 4e. More what I meant was: If you want to play (or try) 4e more than you want to play your character concept, but what you want to play most of all isn't available yet, pick your second or third most favorite idea and play with that one for a while. If you want to play your character more than you want to play 4e, stick with 3.5. Just because 4e is out now doesn't mean you can't play 4e (though I don't plan to play 3.5 anytime soon, but that's just me. You are you, do what you want )

 

[Stalker0]

Huh? You lost me.

I meant to say bow, apologies

 

[Derren]

       Things Lost          |       Things Gained
                            |
Monk, Druid, Babarian       |    Warlord, Warlock
                            |
Free Grapple, Disarm,       |    Marks, Grab
Sunder, Trip                |
                            |
Many Combat Spells          |    Many combat Powers
                            |
Many Non-Combat Spells      |    (Rituals)
                            |
Skill Points                |    -
                            |
Unrestricted Multiclassing  |    -
                            |
Class abilities not         |    -
restricted by weapon choice |

Rituals is in brackets because technically they only represent non combat spells which were not removed.

 

[TimeOut]

You forgot to place Rituals on the "things gained" side.

 

[Derren]

You forgot to place Rituals on the "things gained" side.

Rituals are just non combat spells and they don't balance out what was lost like the powers for non spellcasters do.

I could add them, but then I would have to write "All Non-Combat Spells" under "Things Lost".

 

[TimeOut]

Rituals are just non combat spells and they don't balance out what was lost like the powers for non spellcasters do.

Why not? Just because there are not 100 yet? Or because they are not as abuseable as the old spells were?

You know that any character can use them, right? I would say that is as much a benefit as the gained combat options.

 

[Derren]

Why not? Just because there are not 100 yet? Or because they are not as abuseable as the old spells were?

You know that any character can use them, right? I would say that is as much a benefit as the gained combat options.

What has being abusable to do with it (not that 3E non combat spells were abuseable)?
How many rituals are there? 30? How many spells were lost? Certainly more than that.
Rituals are not things which were added in 4E. They are thing which were not removed from 3E.
But if you insist.....

 

[Ginnel]

       Things Lost          |       Things Gained
                            |
Monk, Druid, Babarian       |    Warlord, Warlock
                            |
Free Grapple, Disarm,       |    Marks, Grab
Sunder, Trip                |
                            |
Many Combat Spells          |    Many combat Powers
                            |
Many Non-Combat Spells      |    Many rituals, accessible to all as well as non combat powers
                            |
Skill Points                |    broader skill classes, jack of all trades
                            |
Unrestricted Multiclassing  |    -
                            |
Class abilities not         |    Martial abilities defined by weapon choice
restricted by weapon choice |

Not too much wrong with yours Derren but i'd just like to add those few points in, I'm not saying one is inherrently better than the other.