D&D General 40 Year D&D Campaign

[Mort]

WOW!! Screw this guy. At 15:51 he tells his player, "Im not asking for you talk"!! I'd have said some choice words and left right there. That is just disrespectful and doesnt seem like fun.

my actual biggest issue (that would have caused SERIOUS problems for me as a player):

He dictates that the group goes to rest and dictates that they are all asleep in their beds, basically naked and with their equipment stowed.

He does not ask if anyone is keeping watch (and doesn't let the group interrupt his narration to say they are).

He, then, has the group ambushed by very, very nasty and well prepared assassins, who do things like (pre-combat) drop a big poison bomb (that the assassins are immune to) with nasty effects (save or immediately at 0 HP).

Now, I'm all for having big nasty bad guys try and ambush the party - but to essentially fiat them into their beds and unprepared? COME ON! I mean, it's not like they're adventurers heading to a dangerous situation and used to being on their guard or something!

 

[R_J_K75]

my actual biggest issue (that would have caused SERIOUS problems for me as a player):

He dictates that the group goes to rest and dictates that they are all asleep in their beds, basically naked and with their equipment stowed.

He does not ask if anyone is keeping watch (and doesn't let the group interrupt his narration to say they are).

He, then, has the group ambushed by very, very nasty and well prepared assassins, who do things like (pre-combat) drop a big poison bomb (that they are immune to) with nasty effects (save or immediately at 0 HP).

Now, I'm all for having big nasty bad guys try and ambush the party - but to essentially fiat them into their beds and unprepared? COME ON! I mean, it's not like they're adventurers heading to a dangerous situation and used to being on their guard or something!

May have been you or someone else upthread that said combat starts at "x" so I watched from about a minute before and stopped when he made that comment. From what I saw...1) Yes it seems hes adjudicating the game to fit his predetermined narrative. I'm not saying he's fudging dice or cheating but more likely interpreting them subconsciously to propel and complete his story.

Pretty interesting case study. Now I'm sure this is an extreme outlier of the spectrum of samples, I think the term is that it "Falls out of Sigma"? This guy would not be on, or near, your best straight line.

 

[Mort]

May have been you or someone else upthread that said combat starts at "x" so I watched from about a minute before and stopped when he made that comment. From what I saw...1) Yes it seems hes adjudicating the game to fit his predetermined narrative. I'm not saying he's fudging dice or cheating but more likely interpreting them subconsciously to propel and complete his story.

Pretty interesting case study. Now I'm sure this is an extreme outlier of the spectrum of samples, I think the term is that it "Falls out of Sigma"? This guy would not be on, or near, your best straight line.

The combat seams REALLY complicated and it's pretty clear that the players (even the experienced ones) have very little idea what most of the rolls/numbers mean. A roll gets made and he dictates what happens. Probably he's been doing this so long that he has whatever tables are being used internalized and can just spout them.

The way it looks, he could literally just dictate whatever result he wanted and the players would have no idea!

But, again, we're lacking context. Maybe they're all studied on the rules and do a lot of communication by email outside the game time.

 

[R_J_K75]

The combat seams REALLY complicated and it's pretty clear that the players (even the experienced ones) have very little idea what most of the rolls/numbers mean. A roll gets made and he dictates what happens. Probably he's been doing this so long that he has whatever tables are being used internalized and can just spout them.

The way it looks, he could literally just dictate whatever result he wanted and the players would have no idea!

But, again, we're lacking context. Maybe they're all studied on the rules and do a lot of communication by email outside the game time.

I was 7 when I was first introduced to 1E AD&D. There was a mystique about it. Only the DM knew "all" the rules, helped you make your PC, and for players the DMG & MM were hands off. Now 40 years later I know that's a crock of naughty word, but seems like this guy still plays like that.

 

[Mannahnin]

I was 7 when I was first introduced to 1E AD&D. There was a mystique about it. Only the DM knew "all" the rules, helped you make your PC, and for players the DMG & MM were hands off. Now 40 years later I know that's a crock of naughty word, but seems like this guy still plays like that.

TBF, I can appreciate the concept of a system which operates as something of a black box for the players, which seems to have been at time Dave Arneson's ideal and intent.

As long as they have enough information to make informed and meaningful decisions, if the DM can handle the mechanics and that helps them achieve and maintain immersion, that could make for a fulfilling play experience. A certain number of D&D early-adopters in the '70s, especially, were advocates of this style of play. The Elusive Shift talks about this.

 

[Mort]

TBF, I can appreciate the concept of a system which operates as something of a black box for the players, which seems to have been at time Dave Arneson's ideal and intent.

As long as they have enough information to make informed and meaningful decisions, if the DM can handle the mechanics and that helps them achieve and maintain immersion, that could make for a fulfilling play experience. A certain number of D&D early-adopters in the '70s, especially, were advocates of this style of play. The Elusive Shift talks about this.

For this style to work you either need a system that can smoothly handle it, which are pretty few IME, or you need a DM who is both encyclopedic in knowledge of the rules and fair in their application. The first is hard enough but to have both the first and second quality - that's really rare.

This DM is (100% clearly) fluent in his system, and I think he's being fair - so this works for the group. And again, if the players are having a blast, that's what counts

 

[Lanefan]

my actual biggest issue (that would have caused SERIOUS problems for me as a player):

He dictates that the group goes to rest and dictates that they are all asleep in their beds, basically naked and with their equipment stowed.

He does not ask if anyone is keeping watch (and doesn't let the group interrupt his narration to say they are).

I haven't watched the video, so...context? Were the PCs in a supposedly-safe environment e.g. in town, or were they in the field?

If they were in the field, the above is a big red flag.

If they were in the (assumed) safety of town? Yeah, for me the players would have had to proactively say they were keeping watch anyway (or have pre-established such as a SOP when in town), and before I started narrating any events during the night.

Even there, I'd still give a low-odds roll for each PC to see if said PC happened to be awake when the attackers showed up, even more so if any of the PCs were Elves.

 

[Lanefan]

The combat seams REALLY complicated and it's pretty clear that the players (even the experienced ones) have very little idea what most of the rolls/numbers mean. A roll gets made and he dictates what happens. Probably he's been doing this so long that he has whatever tables are being used internalized and can just spout them.

The way it looks, he could literally just dictate whatever result he wanted and the players would have no idea!

If the players have been at it for any length of time the chances are they'll be, or have become, pretty familiar with what roll leads to what result, at least in a general sense.

 

[Lanefan]

I was 7 when I was first introduced to 1E AD&D. There was a mystique about it. Only the DM knew "all" the rules, helped you make your PC, and for players the DMG & MM were hands off. Now 40 years later I know that's a crock of naughty word, but seems like this guy still plays like that.

I don't think that's a crock of naughty-word at all.

As a player I like that mystique, and my biggest (and perhaps only) regret about becoming a DM is that it forced me to look under the hood and find out how things worked there.

 

[Mort]

I haven't watched the video, so...context? Were the PCs in a supposedly-safe environment e.g. in town, or were they in the field?

If they were in the field, the above is a big red flag.

If they were in the (assumed) safety of town? Yeah, for me the players would have had to proactively say they were keeping watch anyway (or have pre-established such as a SOP when in town), and before I started narrating any events during the night.

Even there, I'd still give a low-odds roll for each PC to see if said PC happened to be awake when the attackers showed up, even more so if any of the PCs were Elves.

I think they were on a ship sailing toward their destination.

Anyone who's been gaming for ANY length of time knows GMs LOVE to pull water encounters on players!

Heck, I'd say it's the rare boat ride that doesn't have something go very wrong.

So, yeah, the group had EVERY right to be on guard - at the very least to post a watch!

The point is, unless it was edited out (which is possible, I suppose, but I don't think that was going on) the group had 0 chance to decide on what they wanted to do or how they wanted to approach the rest. That's very uncool IMO.