4E encounter spells for AD&D

[FATDRAGONGAMES]

I'm getting ready to run a new AD&D campaign next week. One of my players has expressed an interest in allowing the magic user to have some spells be 'encounter' or 'at will' per 4E rather than the 'fire and forget' traditional system. I'm curious if anyone has experimented with this at all? I am considering something along the lines of having a material focus like a staff or wand that allows multiple uses of certain spells each day/encounter/at will, but I will not have any time to playtest before the game next week. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[mattdm]

There's a Recharge Magic mechanic for 3.5E outlined in Unearthed Arcana (the 3.5E version). You may be able to take some ideas from there.

 

[Treebore]

Well, judging by my 4E play experience I would say you could allow them to choose one spell per level to do all day long. I would not allow them to do above 2nd level though, which will be pretty ugly anyways considering how useful several 1st and 2nd level spells are.

Another balancing aspect of 4E for these spells is that they all require a successful hit, which would equate to a failed save in 1E. So I would also say that any spell cast using this technique allows a save even when their normally is not one. IE Magic Missile, Sleep, etc... So if they select those spells that is the only version they are capable of casting, so it may dissuade them from choosing them in the first place. Not having a save is a pretty sweet thing to give up.

 

[fuindordm]

I'd say this is difficult in 1e.

The MUs spells are meant to be powerful, potentially changing the entire course of an encounter. It's as if a player in a 4e game came to you and said "I really like my dailies,
but I'm not so fond of my encounter power options. Can I use the daily every encounter instead?"

I know life is hard as a low-level MU, but I think this is the kind of house rule you'll regret. It would be better to give each character a nice item to start the campaign, such as a +1 heirloom weapon for the fighters and a partially charged wand or a couple of scrolls for the MUs.

Ben

 

[vagabundo]

I think you would have to ad-hoc changes to the spells. No more autohit MM, so a range attack on AC or some such..

But it is definitely doable, you should make it clear to the player that you may have to make some changes in-game if something is too powerful and he will need to work with you on it.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Well, judging by my 4E play experience I would say you could allow them to choose one spell per level to do all day long. I would not allow them to do above 2nd level though, which will be pretty ugly anyways considering how useful several 1st and 2nd level spells are.

Another balancing aspect of 4E for these spells is that they all require a successful hit, which would equate to a failed save in 1E. So I would also say that any spell cast using this technique allows a save even when their normally is not one. IE Magic Missile, Sleep, etc... So if they select those spells that is the only version they are capable of casting, so it may dissuade them from choosing them in the first place. Not having a save is a pretty sweet thing to give up.

I think Treebore has the major points nailed down well.

I don't have AD&D experience, but I know there were some attempts in 3E to introduce at-will or encounter like abilities. And they never created effects beyond 1st or 2nd level, I think.

So maybe one 1st level spell (with added save, if necessary) as at-will, and one 2nd level spell (with added save, if necessary) as encounter power - once they come available.

Question might be: Do you offer something for non-spellcasters, too?

Basically, the at-will/encounter ability helps out spellcasters at lower levels.
Maybe you add a encounter/daily ability for non-spellcasters at high levels?

Maybe a 7th level Fighter gets an encounter power that lets him attack multiple targets and deal double damage (or 2[W]), and a 10th level Fighter gets a daily power that lets him deal HD x [W] damage?
A 7th level Rogue (or Thief?) gets an encounter power that lets him deal 1/2 HD x [W] damage and at 10th level he gets a daily power that allows him to move and attack multiple targets for 3[W] damage?

[W] standing in for weapon damage, of course.

The benefit of encounters and dailies is that you can spend a game resource to make a decisive attack that can get the party out of trouble and change the course of battle. This is basically all that Wizards do, and nothing Fighters or Rogues can do.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I would say that your far-and-away best option is to look at some of the spells and feats from 3e Complete Mage- There are spells and feats which once prepared give you an 'at will' ability until you actually expend the spell.

e.g.

Clap of Thunder [ reserve ]
pre: ability to cast 3rd level spells
Benefit: As long as you have a sonic spell of 3rd level spell or higher, you can deliver a melee touch attack as a standard action. This does 1d6 points of sonic damage per level of the highest level sonic spell you have available to cast. Additionally the target must make a Fort save or be deafened for 1rd.
Also get +1 caster level on all sonic spells.

Fiery Burst [ reserve ]
pre: ability to cast 2nd level spells
Benefit: As long as you have a fire spell of 2nd level spell or higher, you can spend a standard action to create a 5ft radius burst of fire at a range of 30ft. This does 1d6 points of fire damage per level of the highest level fire spell you have available to cast. A successful Reflex save halves the damage.
Also get +1 caster level on all sonic spells.

(there are about a dozen of these 'reserve spell' feats, which are really neat)

There are also some spells which have 1 hour/level duration (and give a minor benefit) but which can be expended for a greater benefit (e.g. heart of air, heart of fire).

Either of those (but particularly the reserve feats) may help you out here.

Cheers

 

[Plane Sailing]

Doh! I didn't notice you were asking about AD&D rather than 3e.

Nonetheless, if you let someone use one of the 'nonweapon proficiencies' (the precursor of feats) in order to get the benefit of one of the reserve feats, it might work OK.

The other alternative is to just allow the wizard to have something which is the equivalent of throwing a dagger at the target (his main fallback option in 1e!)

Wizard at-will power:

You cast a magic bolt at the target, doing 1d4 damage if you hit its AC. 30ft range

That way you are not giving him any more power than he has at the moment, but allow him to have more flavour.

In addition, pick some of the more cantripy spells and let him do those at will (e.g. the equivalent of light, ghost sound, mage hand and prestidigitation)

Cheers

 

[vagabundo]

In addition, pick some of the more cantripy spells and let him do those at will (e.g. the equivalent of light, ghost sound, mage hand and prestidigitation)

Cheers

This is my favourite part of the 4e wizard class, it makes him seem like a real wizard for the first time for me.

 

[sinecure]

Just have them make up a spell ability the PC can use repeatedly for 24 hours after casting. But the spell cast must be weakenedl, so it actually balances inside its' spell level.

For example, 3rd level Fireball: Instead of 5d6 fire damage you get 17 1-hit point fire attacks. The PC can group as many together as he likes. Maybe up to half?

2nd level invisibility: Instead of permanent until discharged, go with 1 combat round and automatically discharged. But you can re-up the spell with a casting action. But only for 24 hours like all the rest.

1st level Magic Missile: Instead of 1d4/level, make it 2(1/2) 1-hit point attacks per caster level. No Save. Maximum is half the total like Fireball.