D&D 4E 4e Monster Manual excerpt

[Gargazon]

Actually, I see the kiss without a dominated victim as more of a "OH GOOD HEAVENS WHY DO I KEEP THROWING MYSELF IN THE WAY?!" sort of control effect. Running away from it is perfectly acceptable because its an insane compulsion/magical effect and without the dominate, it feels like it too.

Dominate is where you can start composing poems for your one true love. Probably much to the annoyance of the Succubus.

I actually quite like this interpretation. It makes alot of sense to me, and certainly makes for some hilarious (well, for me the DM) moments

 

[frankthedm]

The colors are awesome but the articulations are weird, even for a fiend.
There's something terribly wrong with his left leg. the shin seems turned outwards but the foot is turned forwards.

Either the artist was trying to show otherworldly flexibility in the pit fiend's stance, or the artist could not decide on the stance he wanted the pit fiend in even as it was being painted.

The art does convey the pit fiend is NOT the front line/solo monster anymore. He's stop taking the 'roids and is far more lithe than any previous pit fiend.

 

[Kunimatyu]

The only thing I don't like about the Succubus is that since Dominate (probably) counts as an attack, the succubus can't kiss a victim, then draw them back with a Dominate and still keep the interpose ability on them.

I'll be houseruling that the kiss wears off only if the Succubus deals damage to the target, or if she kisses a different target.

 

[AZRogue]

I think I'd be most pleased with the interpretation:

Dominate = puppet.
1st Kiss = Charmed.
Followup = Interpose yourself between succubus and attacks that target her.

 

[Sojorn]

I always thought of Dominate as more of the being-john-malcovitch "someone is puppeteering my body against my will!" and Charm was the love-poems type of effect.

Good point, and perhaps why the entry seems so confusing.

Dominate and Charm both have a fair bit of baggage as words.

 

[AZRogue]

Any minute now Chris, Rodney, or The Rouse will be in to tell us which interpretation is correct. Right? <looks around hopefully>

 

[Professor Phobos]

Actually, I see the kiss without a dominated victim as more of a "OH GOOD HEAVENS WHY DO I KEEP THROWING MYSELF IN THE WAY?!" sort of control effect. Running away from it is perfectly acceptable because its an insane compulsion/magical effect and without the dominate, it feels like it too.

Dominate is where you can start composing poems for your one true love. Probably much to the annoyance of the Succubus.

Hmm. I read it more as a compulsion to protect and defend the succubus, but not one powerful enough that compels the charmed person to actually attack his allies. I see him intercepting their attacks on the succubus and pleading with them to stop attacking his "true love."

But really I'd be happy with either so long as the player was engaging with the game and not just using some rules loophole to escape consequences.

 

[jaldaen]

(m) Charming Kiss (standard; at-will) * Charm
+14 vs. AC; on a hit, the succubus makes a secondary attack against the same target.
Secondary Attack: +12 vs. Will; the target cannot attack the succubus, and if the target is adjacent to the succubus when the succubus is targeted by a melee or a ranged attack, the target interposes itself and becomes the target of the attack instead. The effects last until the succubus or one of its allies attacks the target or until the succubus dies.

I have not seen anyone mention this so I thought I'd add my two cents...

Even if the PC can move away from the succubus (to avoid interposing himself), couldn't the succubus just follow him around thus "keep him close by"? It'd be pretty interesting to see this "dance" in the midst of combat...

"Come back my daring!" says the succubus.

"No thank you," says the paladin as he runs away.

The succubus prances after the paladin. "I'll never leave your side my dearest!"

"Get away from me you hag!" pleads the poor paladin as he sees one of the NPCs* notch an arrow and fire. The paladin does his duty and bares his chest for his mistress. Thump. The paladin curses under his breath as he takes another arrow for her.

The succubus squeals with delight, "I knew you'd protect me, my knight in shining armor."

"But who'll protect me from you?" asks the paladin resigned to the succubus attached to his hip like a beautiful, but chaffing scabbard.

"Sorry honey," she says with an almost angelic smile. "That's your problem not mine."

*Other PCs would not target the succubus knowing full well the PC will take the attack.

 

[med stud]

I like the absurdity of the succubus- version where it had a 40% chance of gating in a balor! If the succubus was a level appropriate enemy, the PCs would be toast if it succeeded. If the PCs could take on a balor, they could kill succubi by the dozens anyway.

 

[Mirtek]

Well, making the battles last longer and less deadly is one thing, BUT 1d6+8 and 4d4+8?

At a point where even the pregen wizard would have 108 hp (+x healing surges)?