D&D 4E 4e price increase?

[jdrakeh]

That's a bit of an off comparison.

For you. In an objective comparison of sales figures, video games routinely outsell paper and pencil roleplaying games, thus the reason that video game market is collossal and the paper and pencil roleplaying game market is drop in the bucket by comparison. This isn't a guess. This is pretty well verified factual information. The fact that you don't play many video games doesn't change the fact that in terms of commerce, video games routinely outsell paper and pencil games.

What was actually being compared was two video games vs the three core books.

Yes, I know. I can read.

There are only two games I can think of that in my group of friends has had any near the longevity of 3.X:

Halo 2

World of Warcraft.

And of those two WoW will exceed the cost of 3.X on its own as soon as it hits five months.

Again, you're substituting anecdotal experience for widely available and objectively verified marketing data. Google for and check out the latest sales figures for Halo 3 right now. Then Google for and check out sales figure for any current D&D supplement that you like. One of these will have sold millions of copies more than the the other.

Comparing D&D to video games (even two of them) is a bad comparison given that, on any day of the week, more people across the globe are more likely to have purchased two video games than a set of D&D core books. If D&D is such a great investment with tons of return, it stands to reason that it would also be enjoying this level of mass consumption/use.

And it isn't. Not even close.

Basically, my point was that the 'D&D versus video games' model of illustrating longevity or mass consumer appeal (of D&D) is a very flawed one.

 

[Abstraction]

Please don't forget that there is some difference in the manpower between coming up with the entire system using full-time professional game developers and banging out a supplemental book in your basement. I am sure that none of the other "fairly" priced "complete" games out there need as much manpower as WOTC needs to produce a good product.

 

[Fifth Element]

Treebore's argument isn't invalid at all; he's not wrong to apply the theory of marginal value to a good that people don't need. Just because something doesn't have an inelastic demand (like food, a need) doesn't mean economic theory doesn't apply. It's completely reasonable to ask if a product will make you $120 happier--that's the only reasonable way to examine any purchase.

True, but that's not how I read Treebore's post. It appears he suggests that if your current edition (whatever it is) makes you "happy", then you shouldn't even consider buying 4E. The concept of increasing happiness was not addressed - only that if you're currently happy (whatever that means), don't buy it.

 

[Fifth Element]

Basically, my point was that the 'D&D versus video games' model of illustrating longevity or mass consumer appeal (of D&D) is a very flawed one.

That may be true. But weren't you the one discussing the price of the D&D books in terms of the price of car insurance and internet access?

 

[BadMojo]

Perfect example. That's the market economy at work, baby. I wouldn't say that consumers forced Sony to do anything, but I would say that they didn't do their homework on researching the market.

It's also worth noting that Sony is selling a cheaper PS3 with some functionality removed. It would be like WotC deciding that they can sell more PHB copies if they make a soft-cover, black and white "pocket sized" version.

Hey, that's actually something I'd want!

 

[Fifth Element]

It's also worth noting that Sony is selling a cheaper PS3 with some functionality removed. It would be like WotC deciding that they can sell more PHB copies if they make a soft-cover, black and white "pocket sized" version.

Hey, that's actually something I'd want!

That would be the ideal: perfectly discriminatory pricing. An individual price for every buuyer in the market. Perhaps a cheaper edition would be worthwhile. Someone should suggest it to WotC rather than mentioning it here, perhaps.

 

[The Merciful]

you play 120 hours, so its $3 dollar/per hour for 7 ppl.. so its 42c per hour playing dnd, quite a bit less than going to the cinema

Going to the cinema or buying a video game quarentees you get a set amount of entertainment for you money. You don't get any such quarantee by buying a RPG game.

Anyway, anyone got any idea how much WotC might save if they made rules in soft cover and black and white? I'm thinking a cheaper edition would be nice for atracting the younger crowd...

 

[Hella_Tellah]

It's also worth noting that Sony is selling a cheaper PS3 with some functionality removed. It would be like WotC deciding that they can sell more PHB copies if they make a soft-cover, black and white "pocket sized" version.

Hey, that's actually something I'd want!

I have no doubt that's been proposed, and I'd be into that, too. The very fact that it's not on the market, however, tells me that their research shows that not enough people agree with us to make that profitable, or that it would damage sales of the "deluxe" product so profoundly that it wouldn't be worth extending their reach into the bargain market. Or it could be that the aforementioned bargain racks, online outlets and used book stores already have that market pretty well supplied.

I'd love to get my hands on Wizards' market research numbers, actually, because there are so many potential products I'd expect to be really profitable that Wizards just doesn't seem to have any interest in selling.

 

[Imaro]

Please don't forget that there is some difference in the manpower between coming up with the entire system using full-time professional game developers and banging out a supplemental book in your basement. I am sure that none of the other "fairly" priced "complete" games out there need as much manpower as WOTC needs to produce a good product.

I realize this, but my main example was Exalted 2nd ed. I don't think this game qualifies as a supplemental book banged out in a basement. Another good example is the Angel roleplaying game by Eden Studios...or how about the Star Wars roleplaying game or d20 Modern corebook by...WotC. All complete professional hardback games in full glossy color...all $40 or less. I can list more if you want but I don't see the point.

 

[Jack99]

Going to the cinema or buying a video game quarentees you get a set amount of entertainment for you money. You don't get any such quarantee by buying a RPG game.

Anyway, anyone got any idea how much WotC might save if they made rules in soft cover and black and white? I'm thinking a cheaper edition would be nice for atracting the younger crowd...

First of all, there are no guarantees, even when buying a movie or a video-game. The movie could blow and be a fast-forwarder, or even more likely the game could be a real snooze.

Either way, my comment about the cinema was because that was what the OP was comparing. I merely corrected the math.

TBH, I fail to see how anyone who plays DND regularly can say it is an expensive hobby compared to the amount of time one gets out of it. Hell, I spent at least $1000 on DnD the last year alone, and all in all, I still consider it cheap if I compare it to the time i get out of it (playing, preparing, reading, arguing on ENworld etc). Sure, its not as cost-effective as WoW or EQ was, but MMORGs are kinda hard to beat at that game.

Of course, YMMV
Cheers