D&D 4E 4E Psionics

[Deset Gled]

I always got the impression that WotC realized the psionics name was almost permanently scarred by the horrible 2e rules for them, and decided to use psionics as kind of a dumping ground for new ideas. Things like immediate actions (which first started popping up in 3.0 psionics), the concept of per encounter abilities (i.e. spending a full round action to re-gain focus), and talent trees (variations of psions having different skill lists, different powers, and using different ability scores) all originated in psionics. I would imagine that you could find many spells that are tangentially based on ideas originally found as powers.

Assuming this is in some way remotely true, I would expect to see psionics be a bastardized/canibalized/mutiated version of whatever WotC comes up with for the standard magic system, same as they are in 3.x.

 

[CleverNickName]

I always got the impression that WotC realized the psionics name was almost permanently scarred by the horrible 2e rules for them...(snip).

I am in that camp, too. I remember the psionics in the Dark Sun campaign setting, and how it completely broke my game. I'm all for super-powerful characters, but man...some of that stuff was over the top.

But with these new per-day, per-enconter, and per-round abilities, I think Psionics can finally be workable. If it is simply a different kind of magic (from a different power source), I will happily integrate it into my game. If it gets saturated with the weird sci-fi stuff about crystals and ectoplasm and psychokinetic armor, I'm afraid I'll have to pass.

 

[Rechan]

But with these new per-day, per-enconter, and per-round abilities, I think Psionics can finally be workable. If it is simply a different kind of magic (from a different power source), I will happily integrate it into my game. If it gets saturated with the weird sci-fi stuff about crystals and ectoplasm and psychokinetic armor, I'm afraid I'll have to pass.

The 3.5 rules are balanced. I love the system. The flavor, no, but the system itself is solid.

Similar to Incarnum. Lame fluff, but solid rules.

 

[Greenfaun]

I really liked 3.5 psionics mechanically (better than Vancian casting, that's for damn sure) but I always thought the flavor didn't mesh with what for lack of a better term I'll call "Old school D&D."

Y'know, that little bit of cognitive dissonance you get in situations like this:

"This is Magni Boartusk, our Dwarf Barbarian, Illiriel, our elven druid, Bogwort Brandybarrel, a lovable burglar who could charm the phylactery off of a lich, and, um... Tzz'kronk, a giant bug-man who fights with sharpened crystals, has another crystal for a pet, and makes minions to fight for him out of extradimensional snot." o_0

So anyway, I think it's perfectly possible for psionics to work in a fantasy setting, but I'd want something more like the psychic training/witchcraft of Steven Brust's Taltos novels. Basically, everyone has psychic energy, but a few people get good at using it, instead of psionics being this weird alien force that only a few people have heard of.

This might mean that the village hedge-witch was psionics-based rather than druidic/arcane based, since having a psychic talent is easier to accomplish than getting specific training. Similarly, spell-like abilities of more monsters would fall under the psionics curtain (like vampires' dominate and dopplegangers' read thoughts) because dealing with reading minds is a psionic thing universally, just like dumping huge amounts of energy into the physical world is an arcane thing universally.

If they want to fold monks' ki and psychic energy together, I'm alright with that, although it's not the solution I'd personally use. As long as there's a point to monks.

I also like the idea of the psychic/medium. Let's get rooted back to the folkloric origins and build back up from there.

Anyway, I just think psionics should be fully integrated, both mechanically and metaphysically, instead of a parallel magic system with different flavor. I suppose we'll see what they do, I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Kesh]

I was working on a re-write of the Psionics system to have a more mystic/less parapsychology feel, but then 4e got announced. The basic concept was to rewrite the class concept as the Mystic, using animism as the flavor focus (while keeping other options open). Renaming the powers/items/abilities and editing the descriptive text a bit is all it really takes.

Hmm. Maybe I should go ahead and finish that, for the folks who stick to 3.5e...

 

[Nightmare Toilet]

Yes I think the new age crystal stuff should not be what comes to mind with the psionic, and nor should it be some copy of a wizard, hopefully. Just a different use of magic is too close, doesn't distinguish it.

Although I just thought of how rune magic from Death Gate books alters reality, affects probabilities, and maybe something like that would be interesting to include with psionics, using the will to affect probability. I guess that was the old metapsionics stuff that got pretty powerful, like you could disbelieve certain things (like magic or dragons) and thus they could not harm you.

I also watch Naruto, and some of the more powerful genjtusus, especially ones that can actually harm people, seems like decent psionics, like they explain how it is an affect on the chakra in the target's mind, and people can be trained to detect and try to break out of it, but some people are extra good at using their minds, due to a bloodline, to cause actual damage to others. One girl would paint pictures to cause people to think they are experienceing what she painted and they took actual damage and couldn't just break free.

 

[Arkhandus]

Most likely, given what I seem to recall them saying earlier regarding 4E classes, they'll eventually reprint all of the 3.5 base classes (or something like that, maybe a few of them will be folded together though).

So what we'd probably see is.....
PHB 2 or PHB 3, whichever one corresponds to the year in which Eberron is re-released for 4th Edition. Or Dark Sun, but fat chance of that happening first; and Eberron's got enough psionics-related baddies in its background for it to be a relevant inclusion in that year's PHB.
Psion - psionic controller (maybe leader, but that's kinda unlikely)
Psychic Warrior - psionic defender
Soulknife - psionic striker
Ardent - psionic leader

And maybe in the same book, or in a later supplement....
Wilder - psionic striker, leader, or controller, but my first, best guess is striker
Erudite - psionic controller
Divine Mind - psionic leader
Lurk - psionic striker or controller, probably striker

Quick edit - I forgot about that point regarding the likely mixing of ki and psionics stuff as a single force. Bleh. In any case, with that set-up, the monk and ninja would probably show up in the psionics book too, as a psionic controller (maybe defender) and psionic striker, respectively. Soulknife might get bumped back to the supplementary stuff then, alongside the wilder, erudite, divine mind, and lurk.

 

[MatthewJHanson]

The one problem with clairsentient powers is that they're good out of combat abilities, but once you get in combat, you're... useless. I think there should be some sort of balance, as it seems all the other classes are balanced In and Out of combat; at least that seems to be a goal from what we're hearing out of R&C.

Unless your clarisentient abilities allow you to dodge blows, make accurate attacks, or (slightly silly) make your opponent remember his own death, which kills him.

I'd be very interested to see a clarisient striker.

 

[Nightmare Toilet]

Clairsentient Striker would be quite nice. Reminds me of some bloodlines in naruto anime.

Ki mixed with psionic could be good. But that isn't what I think of as mindbender, more like the spirit power in various anime shows, DBZ, Bleach, etc.... Maybe its how the different classes would use it. Monk for physical, psion for invading minds and stuff.

Waiting a year or more blows crystals....

 

[Bacris]

Hmm. Maybe I should go ahead and finish that, for the folks who stick to 3.5e...

Drop me a line if you decide to - I might be interested in funding such a project.

And yes, having to wait til 2009 for WotC's 4E psi rules does suck.