D&D 4E 4e: You Are Dead to Me

Status
Not open for further replies.

pawsplay

Banned
Banned
At first, I was annoyed. The 4e annoucement came a year too early, just in time to crush my plans to run my own d20 publication business. I didn't have any particular emotional responses to the idea itself, as I was not emotionally attached to 3.5 and I always knew 4e would arrive someday. Then we begin to get more information. At that point, I became somewhat sour. To be frank, I am not a big fan of Races of Destiny, the Book of Nine Swords, or the Complete Scoundrel, nor do I consider the Warlock to be a "fix" for the sorcerer. But then I heard some design innovations coming from SW Saga, and I thought, "Hey, that's a cute little game, it could teach D&D tricks." Then I learned they were cribbing the most problematic parts of SW Saga along with some of its innovations, and leaving in latter-edition D&D problems in, like too many exception based powers and huge alpha strikes.

Eventually, I became Zen. 3.5 could be 3.5 and 4e would be 4e. I could like or dislike 4e separately from 3.5, and like or dislike 3.5 separately from its publication support. I decided I would take 4e on its own terms, and even resolved to pre-order the core books to save a few books, figuring I could sell them at no loss later if I chose to.

Then, I started getting the real bad news. Tieflings everywhere! Gnomes weren't in the PHB, frost giants not in the MM. Rogues were flipping over people and stabbing them in the back! Wizards would zot people all day long. All those really specific magic items from the MIC I hated? Those would be the new gold standard. Game world logic? Goodbye, here comes fast play logic.

At some point, 4e became a bad joke to me. I tried not to take it personally. Other people are free to like what they like. But despite my best efforts, I did take it personally. I ended up feeling affronted that I was no longer in the target demographic. Too old, too much time behind the GM screen, too stingy about buying new sourcebooks, too sedate in my tastes. But eventually, I got over that. When I learned the OGL/d20 experiment was basically over, I just rolled my eyes. The GSL seems like a thinly disguised attempt to blackmail third party publishers; give us $5000 or get out of the business, or we might sue you, whether we have a good case based in IP law or not.

I noticed recently it had been a couple of weeks since I had visited EnWorld. I guess I just dropped in to say it will probably be another couple of weeks before I drop in again.

I still have a shelf full of 3.5 stuff. There's a lot of problems with 3.5, but it took years to really bring some of them out in play. I suspect there's some tinkering that could be done to make it work. Right now, I just want to sit out the storm. Play some WFRP, some GURPS, some HERO. Think. Write.

Some day, maybe I'll play 4e. I ended up playing AD&D 2e in college, even though I didn't like AD&D, so anything is possible. Most likely, when I get the itch, it will be something else. Warhammer, GURPS, houseruled 3.5, something else... can't be sure.

But it sure won't be dwarven rogues flipping over minotaurs and stabbing them with ki-enfused punch daggers.
 

log in or register to remove this ad






Incenjucar

Adventurer
pawsplay said:
Then, I started getting the real bad news. Tieflings everywhere!

Needs more rogue modrons.

Gnomes weren't in the PHB

But they ARE in the core rules as a playable race.

frost giants not in the MM

Probably no modrons either.

Rogues were flipping over people and stabbing them in the back!

And fighters were hitting people with swords!

Wizards would zot people all day long.

How dare they, they should only do that with wands in hand!

;)

Seriously though, I don't know you personally, but it sounds like you're frustrated with having your publishing plans stunted, or issues that will be largely moot later in the edition.

Maybe you should just stick with what you know you like until 4E has a chance to develop the missing pieces, and THEN you can judge it? Because the amount of rage I see here suggests you have a great deal of emotional investment here, and that's not something best handled with haste before the full swath of information is even available.
 

Darrin Drader

Explorer
Hey, here's a thought. If 4E isn't for you, it probably isn't for a lot of other people as well. The OGL will still exist, and since you did plan to start your own publishing company, why not do so anyway and then release your houseruled 3.5 as some sort of alternate PHB? The fact is that they can take the web pages down, but they can't take away the OGL or the open game content. Its a free system, and its a good system, so go make the game you always wanted to make. People will buy it if its good, and you'll have a lot fewer publishers to compete with in that market once everyone moves to the GSL and 4E compatible material.
 

I understand that threadcrapping should be avoided but what exactly are we supposed to discuss here? Ok, you wanted to share your feelings with us. How about starting a blog? I really fail to see the need for threads like this as it only stimulates the negative crowd.
 
Last edited:

Henry

Autoexreginated
I'm sorry to hear it. The good news, however, is that 3.5 will be around, the OGL will allow compatible material, or even new innovations and games, and there will be a community supporting it.
 

Kesh

First Post
Guild Goodknife said:
I understand that threadcrapping should be avoided but what exactly are we supposed to discuss here? Ok, you wanted to share your feelings with us. How about starting a blog? I really fail to see the need for threads like this as it only stimulates the negative crowd.
This.
 


MaelStorm

First Post
@Ubbergeek
Yes, you're right. Me too I overreacted the other day, and now I know it was because I jumped to conclusion too easily. There's always a way to make D&D do what you want to do.

@ OP
-There will be rules at the end of the Monster Manual to convert the Gnome as PC.
-There are going to be Giants in the Monster Manual you could easily adapt a Frost Giant.
-If you want you can remove the Tiefling race from your campaign world.
It's an art (adjusting a game), and it's not easy to master, but it will be easier for you if you don't even give it a shot. But it's your call, and I respect whatever your decision will be.
 

Lonely Tylenol

First Post
For the love of Pete, how many "4E is dead to me" threads are there going to be?!

Edit: meh, never mind. Felt good to write it, though.
 
Last edited:


Hathorym

Explorer
It appears you have issue with cosmetic differences, rather than anything concrete. Use make up - play 4e - all the cool popular kids are doing it.
 


pawsplay

Banned
Banned
The OGL will still exist, and since you did plan to start your own publishing company, why not do so anyway and then release your houseruled 3.5 as some sort of alternate PHB?

That's basically the notion I had. However, I'm not the only one to have thoughts along those lines, so it's going to take me a little time to figure out my designs. I want to hew more closely to how I see D&D, but there has to be some originality or it really isn't worth it.
 

lutecius

Explorer
Dr. Awkward said:
For the love of Pete, how many "4E is dead to me" threads are there going to be?!

I'm sure they will keep popping up as new stuff is revealed.
Maybe the "why won't you switch" thread should be revived.
Last time i checked it was slowly decomposing in a mire of soda/syrup.
 


Status
Not open for further replies.

An Advertisement

Advertisement4

Top