D&D 5E 5e and the Cheesecake Factory: Explaining Good Enough

[Snarf Zagyg]

I'd say D&D is more like ordering pizza for a get-together (Return of the Pizza Analogies!) Pizza probably isn't most people's favorite foods, but almost everyone likes some configuration of pizza (cheeseless! gluten-free crust!), and most people have no problem grabbing a slice of cheese or pepperoni even if the pizza doesn't have their favorite toppings.

I don't know, man.

You've met Gary, right? He's doing keto, and he's hardcore. Gluten-free has carbs.
And Anne doesn't like pizza.
Cathy is all about the desert.
Eddie wants to know if they have a breakfast pizza.
Fran wants a salad.
Henrietta needs to know if the kitchen strictly observes her dietary restrictions.

...and Derek needs to get his tequila on. DEREK!!!!!!!!

 

[Ovinomancer]

Yet another snide assumption that people are too dumb/brainwashed/lazy to realize how much better the systems are that you know.

Nope, a comment that people have inertia, and resist change.

Have you every thought that your position attempting to sell a range of RPG systems for 6 years, may have made you atypical?

I wasn't talking about RPGs. That was a (very) small slice of the hobby business, and it was during the d20 glut so everything was pretty much D&D unless you went looking (and I did, but it was a hard business call to bring in small print material that would have trouble moving, especially given the RPG section in the store was about half an aisle). No, I was talking to a very broad range of hobbies. Trains were one, models, oh my, models were hugely representative of this -- people got stuck on brands, even when that brand has a bad, and well earned, rep as lower quality. Slot cars, interestingly. That's a niche hobby, but I had some very interesting conversations with people. R/C, surprisingly, was less representative of this tread -- people were far more willing to move around in that than in other things, probably because everything was so similar to begin with. Cost was the biggest impediment in R/C.

I really appreciate you sharing the knowledge of that part of your career. I can actually view a lot of what you say now in a different light, now I can see that.

You really shouldn't, because you're just adding another layer of assumption (like above) to a picture that isn't real.

 

[TwoSix]

Yet another snide assumption that people are too dumb/brainwashed/lazy to realize how much better the systems are that you know.

But people are lazy. (Believe me, I'm saying that as a lazy person myself.) There are absolutely tons of people who are playing D&D primarily because of inertia. I know and play with plenty of them.

It's totally OK that plenty of people like D&D because they do enjoy its tropes and its system, while also acknowledging that same comfort level has made it easy to never look for something that might fit them better. That's not a D&D specific thing, that's a human thing.

 

[Ovinomancer]

But people are lazy. (Believe me, I'm saying that as a lazy person myself.) There are absolutely tons of people who are playing D&D primarily because of inertia. I know and play with plenty of them.

It's totally OK that plenty of people like D&D because they do enjoy its tropes and its system, while also acknowledging that same comfort level has made it easy to never look for something that might fit them better. That's not a D&D specific thing, that's a human thing.

Yeah, sorry if that didn't come across. I saw this inertia repeated any number of times, but I don't think it's horrible or bad or the mark of a bad person. It's your hobby -- if you're having fun, then you're doing it right. But, when the topic shifts to "this thing is popular, therefore it must be good," I have to hold up the caution flag -- bad argument on the track.

 

[TwoSix]

I don't know, man.

You've met Gary, right? He's doing keto, and he's hardcore. Gluten-free has carbs.
And Anne doesn't like pizza.
Cathy is all about the desert.
Eddie wants to know if they have a breakfast pizza.
Fran wants a salad.
Henrietta needs to know if the kitchen strictly observes her dietary restrictions.

...and Derek needs to get his tequila on. DEREK!!!!!!!!

Sounds like it's time to pick up the phone and order some new friends. I hear Ian, Jennifer, Kevin, Laura, Melissa, and Nick are available.

 

[prabe]

Yeah, sorry if that didn't come across. I saw this inertia repeated any number of times, but I don't think it's horrible or bad or the mark of a bad person. It's your hobby -- if you're having fun, then you're doing it right. But, when the topic shifts to "this thing is popular, therefore it must be good," I have to hold up the caution flag -- bad argument on the track.

Yeah. It's plausible-shading-to-probable that whatever the popular thing is got something right, but that isn't really an argument that it's good. It is (kinda) an argument that it's somewhere in the not-bad/good-enough range, though I'm not going to say it's a strong argument or that nothing bad is ever popular.

 

[fearsomepirate]

I drink Coke. Why? Well, I like it well enough, but mostly because I know I can buy it and while I might like other things, the effort and risk involved (I may pay for something I dislike) creates enough inertia that when I go down the softdrinks aisle, I'm looking for Coke and not looking at the other things on the shelf (Coke Zero Sugar, in particular).

In this regards, I absolutely agree that this is a good analogy for D&D -- it's likeable, comfortable, and looking for other things has an entry cost that many aren't interested in. Especially when we're getting into a completely different kind of drink, like teas.

Even more pertinent is that the most popular cola in any given region is simply whichever brand achieved mass distribution there first. People will tell you they like Pepsi, Coke, or Dr Pepper best for this or that reason, but the real reason is typically "that's who managed to get into every restaurant and grocery store in the region first."

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Sounds like it's time to pick up the phone and order some new friends. I hear Ian, Jennifer, Kevin, Laura, Melissa, and Nick are available.

What? You think I haven't tried?

And each time, I hear the knock on my door, and open it to see Derek ...

"Hey Bud......dy! Forgot to tell me you moved again? Now .... who wants some morning shots?????"

 

[TwoSix]

Yeah. It's plausible-shading-to-probable that whatever the popular thing is got something right, but that isn't really an argument that it's good. It is (kinda) an argument that it's somewhere in the not-bad/good-enough range, though I'm not going to say it's a strong argument or that nothing bad is ever popular.

Yea, I'd say if something is broadly popular, I'd say that's certainly an indicator that it's at least competent enough at meeting the expectations people have it. Those might be low expectations, of course, but at least it's meeting them.

 

[TwoSix]

What? You think I haven't tried?

And each time, I hear the knock on my door, and open it to see Derek ...

"Hey Bud......dy! Forgot to tell me you moved again? Now .... who wants some morning shots?????"

First thing I do when I hear wind chimes is lock the door and hide.