5ft. step triggered by Speak?

[Evil DM]

Hej folks,

I have a question about the 5ft. step:

According to the SRD the 5ft. step belongs to Not an Action, that means: They literally don’t take any time at all to do and are considered an inherent part of doing something else.

At first this seems to fit with the readied action (if you do not ready a move action - yes).
Example:
You are standing next to a hostile wizard and ready a blow if the wizards starts to cast a spell.
The wizard takes a 5ft. step back to avoid a AoO - okay, nothin happens.
He starts to cast his spell - trigger!! You take a 5ft. step and close in to make your attack.
This seems to be rather simple - okay.

But now, how far does this and are considered an inherent part of doing something else go?
As also written in the SRD (to come to my topic) In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn’t your turn.
Does this mean, that you can perfom a 5ft. step as part of speaking even if it is not yourn turn?
If this works this would only have the following restriction:
You can move 5 feet in any round when you don’t perform any other kind of movement.
Thus if it has not yet been your regular turn you can speak an take a 5ft. step but afterwards at your turn your move action must not be moving.

To give an example:
Two PCs are sneaking ahead of the group. They are surprised by a monster which lurked in the shadows. After the surprise round the regular round starts:
DM: "Okay, at ini 17 the monster attacks Player 1 *dice rolled* damage...you are down. The next initiative would be 15 as..."
Player 2: "Wait, I shout out for help and take a 5ft. step back"
DM: "Okay. Now at ini 15 another monster comes around the corner, but as you moved back 5 feet, it cannot reach you. Now, at ini 13 it is your turn Player 2"
Player 2: "Well, as I took my 5ft step I draw my sword as a move action and strike at the first monster which almost killed my companion."

Would this work?

Cheers, Evil DM

 

[Thanee]

I don't think so, no.

Bye
Thanee

 

[FEADIN]

Only immediate actions can be taken outside your turn (and some others clearly indicated).
You can take a 5-foot step before, during, or after your other actions in the round.
Says the SRD....and because you act on your turn you can't act outside so the 5' step is linked, following your exemple you could make an attack of opportunity, speak and make a 5' step to threaten another creature that you suppose is going to provoque another attack of opportunity....good idea

 

[irdeggman]

And Speaking is a Free action - that means it happens during your turn in the initiative.

Most DMs I know may stretch this one somewhat but those are house-rules. The RAW states that speaking is a free action and that free actions occur during your turn in the initiative.

 

[MichaelH]

And Speaking is a Free action - that means it happens during your turn in the initiative.

Most DMs I know may stretch this one somewhat but those are house-rules. The RAW states that speaking is a free action and that free actions occur during your turn in the initiative.

The PHB does not make it hard and fast like that. In fact, it says that you can even speak when it is not your turn. The DM may limit this at times, however. Here's the quote.

In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn't your turn. Some DMs may rule that a character can only speak on his turn, or that a character can't speak while flat-footed (and thus can't warn allies of a surprise threat until he has a chance to act). Speaking more than few sentences is generally beyond the limit of a free action; to communicate more information than that, your DM may require that you take a move action or even a full-round action.

 

[Hypersmurf]

And Speaking is a Free action - that means it happens during your turn in the initiative.

It's an exception.

It's not an immediate action (which would use up your swift action for the round); it's a free action that can be taken outside your turn.

-Hyp.

 

[Evil DM]

It's an exception.

It's not an immediate action (which would use up your swift action for the round); it's a free action that can be taken outside your turn.

Yes that is what the SRD says.

So can it be used as a trigger for a 5ft. step - that is not clear to me yet.

Cheers, Evil DM

 

[Odysseus]

Yes that is what the SRD says.

So can it be used as a trigger for a 5ft. step - that is not clear to me yet.

Cheers, Evil DM

If you had a readied action to react to speech. Then the speech could trigger an action, which could be a 5' step. However the phb p144, says dms may not allow character speech outside their turn to warn other characters(so that they can react.)
And a 5' step , although not a action, still only takes place in your round (when you get to act)
To use your example.
Player two could shout out, and alert other characters. But not take a 5' step, because its not his action. Player twos shouting may result on other characters actions impacting on the monster. But player 2 shouldn't act before the monster unless he had a readied action, or rolled higher intitive.

 

[Evil DM]

And a 5' step , although not a action, still only takes place in your round (when you get to act)

That is my problem. I think you mean the following from the SRD:
You can take a 5-foot step before, during, or after your other actions in the round.

But where is said that they have to been on your initiative count. Please do not get me wrong - I do not want to finde a broken rule by force.
I am just interested if this phrase means that the 5ft. step has to be on your initiative count.
As you probably agree with me: befor, during or after other actions in the round can be read as at any time during the round
As I see: It can be - if someone realy can tell why it has to be only on your initiative count then I will be satisfied at once and the whole problem dies for me.

Cheers, Evil DM

 

[Nim]

So can it be used as a trigger for a 5ft. step - that is not clear to me yet.

You know, I went back to the SRD to check on this and I couldn't even find the spot where it says a 5-foot step is 'not an action'.

Anyway, taking it as a given for the moment that it is, let's try another example:

DM: You hear a click, and the floor beneat you begins to fall away!
Player: Wait! I activate a totally unrelated psi ability as an immediate action, and use the immediate action as an excuse to take a 5-foot step off of the trap door.

Laaaaame.

In fact, can anyone offer a legit example of a 5-foot step that isn't part of a move action, standard action, or full action?

For a specific, RAW response to the original scenario, though..."In general, speaking is a free action that you can perform even when it isn’t your turn," yes. However, being able to take an action outside of your turn doesn't imply that you can take it in the middle of someone else's ACTION. With the exception of Readied and Immediate actions, actions happen in sequential order, not in the middle of each other. So, even if speaking /did/ allow a 5-foot step (which it shouldn't), that still wouldn't allow you to step away from an attack that's already been declared and rolled.