D&D 5E A Sense of Wonder in 5E

[TarionzCousin]

When I first began playing D&D back in the day, I felt a definite sense of wonder at the game. The world (Greyhawk), the characters, the monsters, all evoked in me a feeling of amazement and focused interest.

Everything was very, very cool.

Part of that was no doubt due to my young age, and part of it was due to the fact that everything in the game was relatively new to my friends and me. The first beholder we fought was merely stats and a picture in the Monster Manual until it petrified one PC (and the rest of us ran). It became a thing to be feared.

Later, Dark Sun and Planescape made me feel similar.

What can 5E do to instill something like this? Can it fuel our imagination? Or am I too old and experienced with fantasy tropes, books, movies, etc.?

How can 5E be magic again?

 

[Incenjucar]

For a large portion of people, a sense of wonder is founded in ignorance.

Having a sense of wonder for something you fully comprehend appears to be a matter of personal psychology. I can't think of a way to replicate wonder in those who cannot find wonder in knowledge without head trauma.

As such, the only way to bring about a sense of wonder is to ensure the ignorance of the gamer - by constantly releasing novel ideas.

Which is the exact opposite of the current direction.

 

[delericho]

It's difficult for the game to give you back a sense of wonder. You can't be twelve again!

Additionally, I think that if you're looking to the rules to give you that sense of wonder, you're looking in the wrong place. Fundamentally, the rules boil down to nothing more than a mathematical framework allowing you and your friends to tell the stories. Those maths are never really going to be wondrous.

The place to look for sense of wonder is in the adventures. Epic conflicts against terrible monsters, the discovery of fabulous treasures and priceless relics, the telling of great stories, and the discovery of the unknown. These are the things that can give a sense of wonder.

And in that regard, I think 5e can do three things:

Firstly, and most obviously, it can provide adventures that provide a sense of wonder. Let's not have "Return of the Orc and his Pie". Let's not have another "Sunless Citadel". Or, rather, let's have these things, but make sure they're not the only published adventures! And while "Return to..." adventures probably sell extremely well (at least, relatively speaking), they need to be done sparingly - we need new stories, not just sequels to what has gone before.

But, secondly, the game needs to provide as much help as possible to support DMs in creating wondrous adventures. The DMG needs to discuss lots of terrain types (and not just the obvious mountains, forest, desert, but elemental vistas, ancient cities of gold, and whatever else can be imagined), andmake it easy for the DM to include these, and to evoke the sense of the other-worldly. DMs shouldn't constantly be fighting the rules to include the off-beat; it should be baked-in. Likewise, the game needs to provide easy-to-use tools for creating new and terrible monsters, new and wondrous magic items, and the like. (The 3e tools for monsters design, to give an example of what not to do, are incredibly powerful... but they are so damn hard to use correctly!)

Finally, 5e can make the game easy to run and (mechnically) easy to prepare. Every minute that the game shaves off the DM's prep time is a minute he can rededicate to fleshing out story or character, to dreaming up wondrous sights, or whatever else.

And I think that may be as much as it can do.

 

[Yora]

I started playing only just about the same year 3rd Edition was released. But to me it seems that the sense of wonder pretty much disappeared with 3rd edition. The way WotC produces D&D, it is all very clearly structured and explained, and given stats. There is no ambiguity, instead there's a huge mountain of new options for character optimization. As a result, 3rd and 4th are primarily games about building characters and moving pieces on a grid.
Fixing that is easy, but I don't see how WotC would through their entire work philosophy over board.

 

[Incenjucar]

Obfuscation only works until it doesn't. If you spend time on the internet reading about D&D - any edition - you're going to cease to be ignorant about it, and that ignorance-based wonder will be lost.

 

[Boarstorm]

This topic makes me sad, because it hits a little close to home.

I've spent the last several months nostalgic of my early games, and feeling ennui toward the games I'm currently running. It's just not the same.

Luckily, we've brought in a first-time player, and I'm getting to vicariously enjoy her sense of wonder.

And there-in, I think, is the best answer to what 5E can do to revive that sense of wonder:

Bring in new players.

 

[billd91]

It's difficult for the game to give you back a sense of wonder. You can't be twelve again!

Additionally, I think that if you're looking to the rules to give you that sense of wonder, you're looking in the wrong place. Fundamentally, the rules boil down to nothing more than a mathematical framework allowing you and your friends to tell the stories. Those maths are never really going to be wondrous.

The place to look for sense of wonder is in the adventures. Epic conflicts against terrible monsters, the discovery of fabulous treasures and priceless relics, the telling of great stories, and the discovery of the unknown. These are the things that can give a sense of wonder.

As a 30 year veteran of playing D&D in various incarnations - this is it. The rules are a means to an end - participating in adventures! I still feel a sense of wonder reading the new issue of Paizo's AP, reading the latest adventures, playing in a game and imagining the situations the GM is putting us in (or I'm putting them in and seeing how they react).

I think back in the days before 3e (or, I guess really Players Option books) when the rules got a bit more structured, there was a broader sense that the PCs could do anything the players imagined. But I wouldn't call that a sense of wonder, really. I think that's something different.

 

[Yora]

But it's connected. I think the primary reason is too many rules:

Supposed you arrive at a corridor in which there are corpses with arrows in their back:
Lose rules: "I take my 10 feet pole and poke at the floor plates before I step on them."
Strict rules: "I roll for Trapfinding."

The shorter the character sheet, the more exiting and unpredictable the game.

 

[Minigiant]

A sense of wonder comes with ignorance to what can happen.

Ignorance comes with new stuff.

Everyone knows what a beholder does now. But what happens when a crew of minigiants or a leafthief squad shows up?

 

[SeRiAlExPeRiMeNtS]

For a large portion of people, a sense of wonder is founded in ignorance.

Having a sense of wonder for something you fully comprehend appears to be a matter of personal psychology. I can't think of a way to replicate wonder in those who cannot find wonder in knowledge without head trauma.

As such, the only way to bring about a sense of wonder is to ensure the ignorance of the gamer - by constantly releasing novel ideas.

Which is the exact opposite of the current direction.

To me it certainly was, when we start with d&d (2e) I though everything wondrous because I could only read the players books and my english wasn't very good...